Be Excellent To Each Other

I hope by audience participation it means "leave maliA alone" but with mrsA's propesity for 'joining in with things' I dunno. Hopefully, we'll have lost the tickets. I'd pay £40 to not see him.

Would it be too simplistic to suggest that the best way to stop Israel bombing Palestine would be for Palestine to stop firing rockets into Israel's cities?

Also needs 'and missed' right at the bottom there.

In a similar vein

I don't really get this conflict. It boils down to Israel being created as a nation for the Jews to live in, as they didn't have one, doesn't it? Yet they put it in a place where Arabs have lived for a thousand years and expected the current residents not to be upset? All because the Jews used to live there two thousand years ago, before the Romans invaded and kicked them out?

It's all a bit strange.

It's the fault of the British, ultimately. They could have told the Jews to settle in Anglesey, but NOOOO, Jerusalem or nothing.

*sigh*

Yes, so much so that I suspect it's deliberate.

A government with a stated goal of conquering Israel and repeatedly firing rockets* and mortars at it from civilian areas surely has little reason to complain when Israel gets fucked off with this, and the suicide bombings, and takes steps to put a stop to it.

*1,600 this year so far

Given that Israel has occupied their territory, keeps building new outposts on it, put a stranglehold on imports and exports and movement of people, and regularly shoots them, I'm not surprised they might have a stated aim such as that.

Bored today, Mali?

I'm being charitable and assuming so. Let's not entirely rule out the other possibility though.

They don't seem to want peace.

No, they want their home back.

So whose side should I be on?

Well, yes, quite.

You're British.

So you should side with America...

No. They've got a lot of kit they got off the US for cheaps and need somewhere to play with it. Gaza is like Just Cause 2 for the IDF.

I meant Hamas. They've got form in threatening peace talks and disrupting negotiations.

EDIT: The IDF are mainly conscripts.

I know what you meant. I was just turning your rhetorical device back on you. POW.



Even if that's true, I'm not sure what relevance that has.

Of course by "the Palestinians" here we mean "a terrorist group called Hamas, comprising a tiny minority of the population". Whereas by "Israel" we mean "a democratically elected government of a state which has been elected by a majority of the population".

And of course Hamas are a proscribed terrorist organisation, due to their longstanding history of organising stone-throwing parties in front of Israeli tanks. Unlike the terrorists who founded Israel, they're not “allowed” to form a government.

While I understand that Israel will want to prevent rocket attacks that kill a handful of its civilians, there must surely have been a way of doing it that doesn’t involve killing scores or, as usual, hundreds of innocent civilians, and doubtless creating many more radicalised Palestinians as a result. As Mrs Chris said on seeing those poor dead children during operation Big Lead or whatever it was a couple of years ago when the IDF rolled into Gaza and blew up UN schools and other such horrible terrorist places, if those had been her kids she'd have picked up a gun there and then and killed the nearest Israeli she could find.

In fact, as a civilised democracy, contrasted with the "terrorist Hamas", Israel has a responsibility to pursue its aims in a civilised fashion that complies not only with the Geneva conventions but also basic human morality.

In any event, Israel's actions here will just cause further attacks on Israelis, and the cycle will begin again, as it has many times before, with either side using the actions of the other to justify further attacks.

If Israel wants to solve the Palestinian Question solely through force (which appears to be the case), they'll only manage it when they kill every last Palestinian within Israel's borders. Of course the cynic in me says that would leave Israel without a playground for their military to test their weapons, but there we are.

I’d note that there have been less than 10 deaths from these rockets in a decade. Whereas the ID’s scorecard has a few zeros on the end.

Israel isn't helping what with all of the restrictions on what can go in and out of Palestinian territory, the security walls, the annexation of the good bits of the land, restrictions on work permits etc. Hamas could lay down their arms entirely, but the Palestinians would still be being treated badly - just as they were *before* Hamas got voted in. And as a result oppressed Palestinians are going to pick up sticks, stones and cheapass home made rockets and fight back.

The bottom line is the Israelis want to keep that land, and will do anything they can to make sure they do.

For instance, they've outright rejected the idea of having a single state of Israel with all the Palestinians as Israeli citizens - the reason being that they'd outnumber the Jews and it wouldn't be a "Jewish state" any more.

The fact that the military rockets haven't killed anyone is no excuse to keep throwing them over. I'm fairly sure that israel doens't want open borders so more arnaments can be fed in to be fired at its citizens.

The main issue seems to be palestine recognising Israel, and the numbers in a land swap. israel is quite happy for Palestine to have its own, albeit demilitarized, state.

Thanks for that post Kissyfur. I really don't have much of a clue as to what all the trouble is about over there.

I'm fairly sure the Palestinians don't want Israel to have open borders so the US can keep feeding in more bombs and white phosphorus to use on women and children, but hey ho.


Hahahahahah! Yeah. Of course it is. And even were that true, why should a new "Palestine" accept that it should basically be a province of Israel, with Israel having control over its borders, imports, exports, travel and so on? And why should they accept the formalising of the theft of their land?

The only realistic option for peace is a one state solution, but no-one's going to go for that. Hamas like their freedom fighter status too much, and Bibi likes the hard man posturing, which is what he got voted in on.

It is true:

http://www.haaretz.com/news/netanyahu-b ... e-1.277915
http://www.timesofisrael.com/netanyahu- ... ian-state/

A one state solution won't happen, as you described why earlier. Hamas have fired phosporus into Israel this year.

So, to address the contingent question which came after "even if that were true", why should the Palestinians be grateful for Israel offering such a crock of shit? "We've nicked your whole country, displaced millions, and we're willing to let you have two unconnected scraps of it back, with no ability to have meaningful infrastructure or trade or any way to defend yourselves. What? You ungrateful shits! Honestly, we're trying here, but there's just no partner for peace."



Yes, and the sad thing is it's the only possible method for lasting peace.



Well that makes it alright then.

I suspect you're deliberately being obtuse, so I'll leave it there.

Probably best, aye.

I haven't watched this yet, but it's apparently very comprehensive

If we had a normal conversation about it, it'd probably be more interesting.

I've been available in Manchester, Bedford and Derby this year.

Not today though.

Book early to avoid disappointment.

You're a disappointment.

I get that a lot.

Hey, Mr Chris! Look! LOOK!

I've got a handy thing for charging my phone when I'm out and about, and I've just realised that IT CAN CHARGE ITSELF!



LIMITLESS POWER!

The file name may suggest I've been sitting on that joke for a while*. IGNORE IT!


* "So that's why it was so flat" ho ho

I walked past a pro-Palestine demonstration the other day. Whenever they chanted 'Free Palestine' I kept on mentally adding 'with every pack' and giggling to myself.

Now all we need is a grenade and a full Bergen.

Telephone interview tomorrow. They, apparently, loved my Excel skills.

Interesting article about one of the creators of 'The Hobbit' on the speccy. Hadn't realised that she also wrote 'Penetrator' which was a decent Scramble clone.

Your Mum wrote 'Penetrator'.

On my Winky.

Bastard. That's my idea! I patented free energy.

Bizarre trufax: clock-wearing imbecile Flavor Flav (otherwise known as 'the one that looks like a pillock and does fuck all apart from shouting random shit in Public Enemy) is a musical genius, and can play fifteen instruments. Hence why Chuck D didn't quietly get rid as soon as possible.

Oddly enough, I'm listening to Public Enemy right now (the incredible "Harder Than You Think", details fans).

Which was in the quiz at the cottage (and nobody got it).

Was it? Do you have a different version to me?

(Starts with "Yo Chuck, bust a move, man" over an acoustic guitar)

I got it, I just didn't put it down because I thought I'd let the others have a chance at winning.

I fear I was paying about as much attention at that point as I do at the normal quiz.

Fifteen more sleeps!

Same version; it was the theme for Channel 4's coverage of the Paralympics.

I think one team got the group right, but that was it.