Steam for your lounge PC

Doctor Glyndwr · **Joined:** 30th Mar, 2008 **Posts:** 32624

http://kotaku.com/5941793/valve-is-brin ... t-consoles

Quote:

Today, Valve will launch the beta of Big Picture mode, a version of Steam designed for your television. That's right. The de facto central hub of PC gaming is now designed to run while you're lounging in your living room—and with a controller, no less. I've tried out Big Picture. It's sleek, intuitive, and groundbreaking in several ways.

No, this new "Steam TV" isn't going to make our video game consoles go away. It's not going to turn your Xbox into a doorstop or obviate your PS3. But Big Picture could be a crucial first step toward making PC gaming more accessible, more convenient, and more suited for living rooms than ever before.
Here are the basics: this afternoon, when Big Picture goes live, you'll be able to push a button and turn Steam into an entirely new interface. It sort of looks like the dashboard on an Xbox 360, minus the advertisements and other clutter that can make that system so irritating to navigate. And it allows you to do almost everything you can do on vanilla Steam: you can buy games, browse the web, and even chat with your friends using the platform's standard in-game overlay.

The fonts, icons, and menus are all large enough to be comfortably viewed on a big-screen television, and the prompts are designed for a game controller. You can use Big Picture on your normal monitor with a mouse and keyboard, but that would defeat the purpose: this is an interface designed for your living room. Because the living room, Valve says, is where most people prefer playing video games.

And maybe, just maybe, if fans seem to want it, and if it makes financial sense, the people who make Half-Life will use Big Picture to create their own version of a video game console.

(There's a lot more of the original post.)

A Valve "console", that's actually a fairly standardised PC spec with a wireless pad and a ten-foot-UI version of Steam, could be a fucking excellent thing.

Edit -- the on-screen keyboard is interesting:

Cras · **Joined:** 30th Mar, 2008 **Posts:** 49244

Doctor Glyndwr wrote:

A Valve "console", that's actually a fairly standardised PC spec with a wireless pad and a ten-foot-UI version of Steam, could be a fucking excellent thing.

See, here's my issue with that. To actually take any advantage of a standard hardware spec would really require custom compiled versions of each game. Which means your Steam library is fragmented across versions that are optimised for Steam on TV, and ones that aren't.

And what would it run? If it's a windows PC, then it's not exactly going to be a sleek, low power machine sat under your TV. And if it's not a windows PC (I heard rumours of Android, at one point), then the vast majority of your games library - which is Steam's USP - won't work.

Doctor Glyndwr · **Joined:** 30th Mar, 2008 **Posts:** 32624

Craster wrote:

If it's a windows PC, then it's not exactly going to be a sleek, low power machine sat under your TV.

Sure. It'd probably be quite small, but need loud, powerful fans to keep it cool. So just like the 360 and PS3, then.

Trooper · **Joined:** 4th Mar, 2010 **Posts:** 22391

Craster wrote:

Doctor Glyndwr wrote:

A Valve "console", that's actually a fairly standardised PC spec with a wireless pad and a ten-foot-UI version of Steam, could be a fucking excellent thing.

See, here's my issue with that. To actually take any advantage of a standard hardware spec would really require custom compiled versions of each game. Which means your Steam library is fragmented across versions that are optimised for Steam on TV, and ones that aren't.

However my Steam library is already fragmented. I have both Mac and Windows games, this would just be another variant.

Doctor Glyndwr · **Joined:** 30th Mar, 2008 **Posts:** 32624

I have a reasonably capable gaming PC in my office, in a mahoosive Lian Li case, not even plugged in right now. I wish it could be coerced to fit into my living room -- this would be ideal for playing any number of games. In particular, it would open my Steam library up to Danielle.

Cras · **Joined:** 30th Mar, 2008 **Posts:** 49244

Trooper wrote:

However my Steam library is already fragmented. I have both Mac and Windows games, this would just be another variant.

Right - now imagine that they launched a set-top box that only ran even less Steam games than your Mac does. Would you be impressed? Enough to buy one?

You didn't buy a Mac because it had Steam. Literally the only reason to buy one of these boxes would be for Steam games. And if they don't exist....?

myp · **Posted:** Mon Sep 10, 2012 16:48

Fewer.

Trooper · **Joined:** 4th Mar, 2010 **Posts:** 22391

But that is the same argument for any new gaming system. When I bought my Xbox there were hardly any games for it. A Steam-box would be in the same position, but with a head start.

I wouldn't buy a set-top box for Steam. However I would install this on my HTPC which is already under the TV...

Cras · **Joined:** 30th Mar, 2008 **Posts:** 49244

Trooper wrote:

But that is the same argument for any new gaming system. When I bought my Xbox there were hardly any games for it. A Steam-box would be in the same position, but with a head start.

I wouldn't buy a set-top box for Steam. However I would install this on my HTPC which is already under the TV...

Not at all. Steam's USP is that it's got to be the biggest ever library of games in one place, ever. This would...break that.

And I agree with your second point. You'll note that the thing I argued with was the 'Steam PC' not the new UI for use on your TV.

Doctor Glyndwr · **Joined:** 30th Mar, 2008 **Posts:** 32624

Craster wrote:

You didn't buy a Mac because it had Steam. Literally the only reason to buy one of these boxes would be for Steam games. And if they don't exist....?

Sure. So a Steam "console" would actually be a small Windows PC. Why is that a controversial conclusion?

myp · **Posted:** Mon Sep 10, 2012 16:55

This will be quite cool for plugging my laptop into my TV, I reckon.

Bamba · **Joined:** 25th Jul, 2010 **Posts:** 11128

Craster wrote:

See, here's my issue with that. To actually take any advantage of a standard hardware spec would really require custom compiled versions of each game.

Not necessarily. You could have a box sold by Valve which is just a 'normal' Windows PC which then ran every Windows game and then either:

You takes your chance with compatibility just like all PC gamers currently do; or
Valve requires some level of testing and compatibility checking before something's allowed on Steam (or, at least, somehow 'certified' to run on the ValvePC); or
Valve use their not-inconsiderable heft in the PC gaming spec to somehow encourage developers to test for compatibility with their specific PC (either by giving financial discounts or preferential advertising or something) to try and get their box adopted as a de facto standard.

None of these options require actual specials version of games, they just try and mitigate the issue that can give rise to issue when gaming on a PC. Obviously it's not going to give the 100% compatibility of a proper console but maybe that doesn't need to be the target? They'd have to tread carefully with the marketing of course because if they couldn't guarantee 100% compatibility then they couldn't promise it, but personally I'd be very tempted by something like this if I thought I'd get more support and less hassle than from just buying a random PC.

Cras · **Joined:** 30th Mar, 2008 **Posts:** 49244

Doctor Glyndwr wrote:

Craster wrote:

You didn't buy a Mac because it had Steam. Literally the only reason to buy one of these boxes would be for Steam games. And if they don't exist....?

Sure. So a Steam "console" would actually be a small Windows PC. Why is that a controversial conclusion?

A few reasons.

1) The value of dedicated hardware is in optimisation. That's why, for equivalent spec hardware, a 360 game will typically run better than a PC game. But the devs have to write it in that fashion - which means starting from scratch on your software library.
2) How would a 'small' Windows PC work? Surely you'd want it to be a good spec gaming PC? In which case it'd probably need to be fairly large. And how would you play the upgrade game? Would they have to sell it cheap enough that you'd throw it away and buy a new one every few years? If so, there goes any money to be made on the hardware. Especially when you factor in the cost of a Windows license.
3) I had a 3, but I've forgotten what it was.

Doctor Glyndwr · **Joined:** 30th Mar, 2008 **Posts:** 32624

Craster wrote:

1) The value of dedicated hardware is in optimisation. That's why, for equivalent spec hardware, a 360 game will typically run better than a PC game. But the devs have to write it in that fashion - which means starting from scratch on your software library.

Not necessarily. You're looking at it backwards. This could be about expanding the existing Steam footprint, rather than taking consoles on head-on. For the former, it doesn't matter if games are optimised to ring every last ounce out of the hardware -- as long as it's decent enough to run most Steam games in reasonable clip it would do the job. Many PC games already ship with 360 pad support, so that's another box ticked before you even start.

Quote:

2) How would a 'small' Windows PC work? Surely you'd want it to be a good spec gaming PC? In which case it'd probably need to be fairly large.

Plenty of Shuttle-style systems can offer enough room for a midrange CPU, GPU, and a single SSD. Leave the optical out. Look at the Mac mini, for an example on the even smaller side, if you wanted to live with all-in-one integrated chips and sacrifice upgradeability. I claim that's small enough, physically, and big enough, spec-wise.

Hearthly · **Joined:** 11th May, 2008 **Posts:** 13386

I've never had any problem using the existing Steam interface on a PC connected to a big telly, although I can see the appeal of having the whole thing controlled by a gamepad rather than a keyboard + mouse.

They really need to have a 'Steam PC' to sell though, just a standard mid-range PC in a small case, running Windows 7 with that 'auto-boot into Big Picture' routine the article mentions, should do the job.

Something along the lines of the Alienware X51 would be ever better, but cheaper, natch.

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Hearthly · **Joined:** 11th May, 2008 **Posts:** 13386

Doctor Glyndwr wrote:

Plenty of Shuttle-style systems can offer enough room for a midrange CPU, GPU, and a single SSD. Leave the optical out. Look at the Mac mini, for an example on the even smaller side, if you wanted to live with all-in-one integrated chips and sacrifice upgradeability. I claim that's small enough, physically, and big enough, spec-wise.

They're pretty much there already, the latest Intel CPUs are running cooler than ever, add in a graphics card based on Nvidia's Kepler architecture, and you've got a powerful PC in a very small space.

In fact, I note that the X51 can now be configured with a GTX660 (albeit at considerable cost, and it is cut down from the 660Ti), along with a high end Core i7 CPU.

This is in a case that's about the same size that the original XBox360 was stuffed into, and is almost identically proportioned to the original 'fat' PS3.

If Valve can get enough buying power into the equation, it's conceivable they could do this thing at a price point that won't be a country mile away from the next-gen games consoles, whilst packing a whole lot more power and having access to the full Steam experience - a compelling proposition.

Plissken · **Posted:** Mon Sep 10, 2012 20:16

Why would Valve want to sell hardware? There isn't anything in it for them. What they appear to have is a decent (if not total) stranglehold on selling PC games. Basically, the OEMS sell the iPods and they've got the iTunes Store. As long as they can deliver a user experience on the platform, they don't need to produce their own hardware.

ApplePieOfDestiny · **Joined:** 17th Dec, 2008 **Posts:** 8293

Vanity?

Also, while your iTunes example is relevant, it does leave them exposed to a competitor opening a better store, a hardware lock in could offer some protection against that, in much the same way that many iPhone users know they may not have the best hardware in this generation or this, but the historical app investment keeps them loyal.

Doctor Glyndwr · **Joined:** 30th Mar, 2008 **Posts:** 32624

Plissken wrote:

Why would Valve want to sell hardware? There isn't anything in it for them. What they appear to have is a decent (if not total) stranglehold on selling PC games. Basically, the OEMS sell the iPods and they've got the iTunes Store. As long as they can deliver a user experience on the platform, they don't need to produce their own hardware.

I'd say it's more likely they'd either partner with an OEM to lend it brand strength (the "Alienware Steam") or introduce a licencing scheme for multiple OEMs.

Hearthly · **Joined:** 11th May, 2008 **Posts:** 13386

Plissken wrote:

Why would Valve want to sell hardware? There isn't anything in it for them. What they appear to have is a decent (if not total) stranglehold on selling PC games. Basically, the OEMS sell the iPods and they've got the iTunes Store. As long as they can deliver a user experience on the platform, they don't need to produce their own hardware.

Well if you take BEEX as a sample, then a lot of folks here choose to play on the 360 because their mates are also on the 360, because it's a 'low hassle' gaming solution, because it's relatively cheap, and because it's got 'big telly whilst sat on the sofa appeal'.

Lest we forget that in raw hardware terms, the 360 is basically a PC in a small box, and the next XBox will be even more so. What the 360 brings to the table is none of the perceived hassles of PC gaming, and a 'Steam Box' could maybe break that perception.

PCs are fiddly in a lot of ways, you don't just go out and buy 'a PC' in the same way you go out and buy an XBox 360 or a PS3, and whilst Windows 7 has worked miracles in a lot of ways, there's no denying the fact that PCs can still be troublesome in some regards.

If Valve can partner up with OEMs and produce a 'Steam Box', perhaps with a choice of styles, maybe even three hardware standards, 'basic', 'pro' and 'extreme' as general headings for how powerful the underlying hardware is - all will run 'Steam Box Certified' games but with a choice of preset settings or something like that - they could really be onto a winner.

If you can get a Windows 7 powered PC, 'skinned' with Big Picture, that you genuinely just take out of the box and connect up like you do a 360, then an entire new demographic could be opened up to PC gaming, because they'll be able to avoid all the 'pesky PC stuff' pretty much completely.

Hearthly · **Joined:** 11th May, 2008 **Posts:** 13386

ApplePieOfDestiny wrote:

Also, while your iTunes example is relevant, it does leave them exposed to a competitor opening a better store, a hardware lock in could offer some protection against that, in much the same way that many iPhone users know they may not have the best hardware in this generation or this, but the historical app investment keeps them loyal.

Excellent point.

If they can get folks feeling a sense of investment with their Steam games collection, and also sell it hard on the fact that 'you can play these games on any PC or laptop, as well as the new Steam Box under the telly, just sign into your Steam account' then they've got a really compelling reason to keep people spending and playing with them. Also, Steam transcends hardware generations, there's no worry about games breaking or stopping working after a certain period of time because the console to play them on doesn't exist any more - even if the Steam Box breaks, any PC or laptop will continue doing the job in the interim.

The Steam Community, achievements, chat, friends, reviews, VOIP, recommendations etc stuff has been coming on really well over the years, to the point now that I suspect it's basically in a 'ready to go' format already for some kind of Steam Box system.

I suspect Valve have already got all of this shit mapped out, in the same way that they launched Steam as the 'Counter Strike Patching System' (when they clearly had far bigger plans for it already in the pipeline, i.e. Half Life 2), I think Big Picture, whatever they might say publicly, is a precursor to a proper Steam Box being released - they just want to chuck the new Big Picture toy out of the door first and see what people do with it.....

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