Nokia announces huge losses

Doctor Glyndwr · **Joined:** 30th Mar, 2008 **Posts:** 32624

This is part of why I didn't take a job there.

http://www.theverge.com/2012/4/19/29595 ... ial-report

Quote:

Nokia's Q1 2012 financial report has just been posted, noting an operating loss of €1.3 billion that led to a net loss of €590 million for the period. The company did warn us that it wouldn't be able to maintain its earlier forecast of breaking even, and now we know the full extent of the damage. In total, Nokia sold 11.9 million smart devices during Q1, which is less than half of the 24.9 million it achieved in the first three months of 2011. This has been put down to the rapid decline in Symbian handset sales, which Nokia says have been "partially offset by growing sales of Nokia Lumia devices."

Operating losses from the Smart Devices and Services division alone amounted to €219 million, equivalent to a -5.2 percent operating margin. That compares to much more buoyant numbers of €729 million and 10.3 percent, respectively, during the same period last year, a time when Nokia was still relying on Symbian as its main OS while preparing to make the move to Windows Phone.

This is an understandable period of transition for Nokia, as it seeks to establish its new mobile platform, though it doesn't look like it'll be coming to an end any time soon — the company forecasts Q2 2012 operating margin from its smartphones to be at or below the current loss-making levels.

Could it be doomed? I don't think it's a given that Nokia will make it out of this.

Zardoz · **Posted:** Thu Apr 19, 2012 12:20

Bloody hell.

WTB · **Joined:** 27th Mar, 2008 **Posts:** 14497

That's what happens when you rest on your laurels and fail to innovate. Was inevitable really.

Bobbyaro · **Joined:** 18th Apr, 2008 **Posts:** 11897

You should totally and go and work for Nokia, Doc! :?

TheVision · **Posted:** Thu Apr 19, 2012 12:37

But imagine if you did work for Nokia and were responsible for turning the company around.

That would be great.

Also, I think the Nokia Lumia 800 is the best phone I've ever owned. Shame that no one else has embraced it like me but to be honest, with the competition out there, I can hardly blame them.

A friend of mine works for Orange and he's told me of the Nokia rep that comes to visit them. He reckons she's not very enthusiastic about promoting the phones. In fact, she's hopeless! People like that can't help the cause.

Doctor Glyndwr · **Joined:** 30th Mar, 2008 **Posts:** 32624

TheVision wrote:

Also, I think the Nokia Lumia 800 is the best phone I've ever owned. Shame that no one else has embraced it like me but to be honest, with the competition out there, I can hardly blame them.

The general public reaction to WP7 in general, and the Lumias in specific, appears to have approximately been "hey, that looks great! Now please sell me the Android/iPhone I asked for."

Crap like this can't be helping matters.

WTB · **Joined:** 27th Mar, 2008 **Posts:** 14497

At this stage I don't think it matters how good the Lumia is - they've taken far too long to respond to the iPhone and the Android handsets. The last half-decent phone anyone gave a shit about was the N95. They've been off the map since then, and that's too long.

Grim... · **Posted:** Thu Apr 19, 2012 12:44

WTB wrote:

The last half-decent phone anyone gave a shit about was the N95.

Amen, brother. All these poxy "smart-phones" will soon go the way of the Amstrad Emailer, just you wait.

WTB · **Joined:** 27th Mar, 2008 **Posts:** 14497

Haha!

metalangel · **Posted:** Thu Apr 19, 2012 12:55

Not surprised... Mrs Metal has a Nokia touch-screen phone (can't find the model number) and using the touch screen to navigate menus virtually unchanged since the 6230 just isn't enough.

I can see why they threw their lot in with WP7: it would make them unique and it just might have taken off. Alas, they're likely to be the also-ran this time around, who've sat back confident in their dominant position and been left behind.

Squirt · **Joined:** 31st Mar, 2008 **Posts:** 6608

The can always revert back to their core pulp-mill business.

Nokia must be such a big deal in the Finnish economy that losses like this must affect the country as a whole.

Wullie · **Joined:** 27th Jun, 2008 **Posts:** 6183

TheVision wrote:

But imagine if you did work for Nokia and were responsible for turning the company around.

You could go one better than Jesus Jobs & become bigger than God, you've already got the massive voice for starters

Firefox · **Joined:** 20th Mar, 2010 **Posts:** 261

Their actual phone hardware looks pretty sexy. If they swallowed their pride and ported Ice Cream Sandwich to it they'd be laughing.

Doctor Glyndwr · **Joined:** 30th Mar, 2008 **Posts:** 32624

Firefox wrote:

If they swallowed their pride and ported Ice Cream Sandwich to it they'd have no competitive advantage over HTC and Samsung and Motorola and all the other identikit Android OEMs.

Feex.

Bobbyaro · **Joined:** 18th Apr, 2008 **Posts:** 11897

apart from many years more design process and a large production set up which could allow them to work more efficiently, coupled with a "Western" viewpoint which is appreciated in many places (including large Asian markets) which allows innovative hardware design and high quality build standard - allegedly.

Edit: my Nokia 6800 was a pig to use, but only due to the software; hardware wise it was quick and solidly built and survived a lot of stuff my HTC wouldn't have.

Pundabaya · **Joined:** 30th Mar, 2008 **Posts:** 5016

I've always though Nokia were overrated, they just lucked out and had "the" model to have when mobiles became something that ordinary people could have.

metalangel · **Posted:** Thu Apr 19, 2012 18:17

The old stuff (circa 1998) was nice to use, and the standard interface meant if you knew one Nokia you could easily figure out the others too. Plus, Snake and Xpress-on covers!

Hearthly · **Joined:** 11th May, 2008 **Posts:** 13386

Was it the 3310 that was indestructible?

You could use those fuckers as battering rams.

I had Nokia mobiles for years, but somehow they just didn't seem to realise that everyone was improving and innovating around them, and it felt like choosing a mobile stopped being 'Which Nokia is best for me' to 'Anything apart from a Nokia please'.

My mate had a N95 and he had some weird sort of emulator/OS on it that could run Quake, which was impressive but also completely pointless.

Think I'd moved onto a Samsung D500 by then.

Pundabaya · **Joined:** 30th Mar, 2008 **Posts:** 5016

Ah, the D500, that was an awesome phone. Compact, built like a tank. In fact, it was the only phone I can remember since the early nokias where the majority of my friends had one.

Hearthly · **Joined:** 11th May, 2008 **Posts:** 13386

Pundabaya wrote:

Ah, the D500, that was an awesome phone. Compact, built like a tank. In fact, it was the only phone I can remember since the early nokias where the majority of my friends had one.

The D500 was the first phone I saw running full screen video clips at a proper framerate.

I was like, 'I don't care how much it costs, I am leaving the shop with one.'

Doctor Glyndwr · **Joined:** 30th Mar, 2008 **Posts:** 32624

Bobbyaro wrote:

coupled with a "Western" viewpoint which is appreciated in many places (including large Asian markets)

Hmmm. Not sure the Western influence helps, though, judging by the huge market shares (65%+) being picked up in Asia by localised forks of Android.

WTB · **Joined:** 27th Mar, 2008 **Posts:** 14497

The N95 was excellent. A proper Swiss Army Knife of a phone. It had everything. I kept discovering more and more stuff about it throughout the year I used it. Then I got an iPhone.

Hearthly · **Joined:** 11th May, 2008 **Posts:** 13386

WTB wrote:

The N95 was excellent. A proper Swiss Army Knife of a phone. It had everything. I kept discovering more and more stuff about it throughout the year I used it. Then I got an iPhone.

It wasn't exactly svelte though, was it?

Plus the battery died a spectacular death in very short order when it was in 'show off' mode.

WTB · **Joined:** 27th Mar, 2008 **Posts:** 14497

Function over form, AE! Well, except the battery life, as you mention...

Wullie · **Joined:** 27th Jun, 2008 **Posts:** 6183

Talking of battery life... that's the main reason I've no jumped ship to one of the more capable smartphones. My trusty E63 with it's 2 year old battery still lasts around 3 days on a single charge!

Any decent phones got a battery that lasts more than a day yet? Preferably one with a proper keyboard or even a numberpad since I still can't get on with typing on touchscreens (even the ipad annoys the fuck out me).

Too much to ask for? Though so

metalangel · **Posted:** Thu Apr 19, 2012 20:45

WTB wrote:

The N95 was excellent. A proper Swiss Army Knife of a phone. It had everything. I kept discovering more and more stuff about it throughout the year I used it. Then I got an iPhone.

Likewise. And in true "welcome to the future" fashion, its web browser was a leap forward from everything I'd used on a mobile device... and with my iPhone I can't imagine going back to the cloying shit that was the N95 browser (I never get along with Skyfire)

Grim... · **Posted:** Thu Apr 19, 2012 22:35

AtrocityExhibition wrote:

WTB wrote:

The N95 was excellent. A proper Swiss Army Knife of a phone. It had everything. I kept discovering more and more stuff about it throughout the year I used it. Then I got an iPhone.

It wasn't exactly svelte though, was it?

Well, it wasn't huge. And it had that cool twin-direction slidey thing. And (like other people have mentioned about old phones) you could drive over it with your car after dropping it into a river, and it would be fine.

What was the show-off mode?

metalangel · **Posted:** Thu Apr 19, 2012 23:10

Grim... wrote:

Well, it wasn't huge. And it had that cool twin-direction slidey thing. And (like other people have mentioned about old phones) you could drive over it with your car after dropping it into a river, and it would be fine.

Mine survived being in the right-hand outside pocket of my bike jacket when I crashed and landed on my right side. There is a bit missing from the lower corner but only a tiny amount.

However, it also slid itself open (unlocking itself in the process) and called my parents. While we were on Santa Monica Beach at 3pm local time. Woken in the middle of the night, my mother was convinced the sound of us talking in the distance and the rustle of my pocket was in fact us being murdered by crazed gang members or something, and worked herself in quite the successful panic.

Firefox · **Joined:** 20th Mar, 2010 **Posts:** 261

Doctor Glyndwr wrote:

Firefox wrote:

If they swallowed their pride and ported Ice Cream Sandwich to it they'd have no competitive advantage over HTC and Samsung and Motorola and all the other identikit Android OEMs.

Feex.

Well, no. It'd have the Nokia name, the Nokia industrial design, plus it'd be able to run Android apps.

That's what average Joe wants when he goes into a phone shop: something from a recognised brand that looks really cool and will run Angry Birds or whatever his mates are running that week. That's as deep as most people go when picking a phone.

myp · **Posted:** Thu Apr 19, 2012 23:28

WP7 has Angry Birds.

Grim... · **Posted:** Thu Apr 19, 2012 23:54

Is there a Java version?

Plissken · **Posted:** Fri Apr 20, 2012 0:05

It wouldn't surprise me if there was a ZX81 version.

metalangel · **Posted:** Fri Apr 20, 2012 0:41

myp wrote:

WP7 has Angry Birds.

My DAD has finished Angry Birds in Space. :facepalm:

WTB · **Joined:** 27th Mar, 2008 **Posts:** 14497

Angry Birds is fucking rubbish! Honestly I can't understand its runaway success. There are so many other great games that are just as simple. IDGI.

DavPaz · **Joined:** 27th Jun, 2008 **Posts:** 38654

Agreed. It's boring

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