Be Excellent To Each Other

I can't say I'm terribly bothered about having any more than 6 megapixels which I have now but I want better recording facility.

My current Fuji F10 has a nice clear picture when recording but the sound compression makes things horrible at gigs. Bit of a tough one to cope with there I know. It would be rather handy if the camera was able to be set to a really low volume record level and not adjust itself to the volume of the surroundings.

Ability to take photos without flash at gigs and not be blurry would also be quite handy.

Any ideas?

The photos isn't really so much of an issue. I can occasionally get by with my current camera. Most important is the record function being able to cope with the sound levels.

My budget ideally isn't above £200 and preferably around £150.

You're probably best just buying a decent seperate microphone + recorder then. (Which might be what you were hinting at... )

I have considered taking my mindisc recorder along to gigs as well so I can get some reasonable sound and then mix it back together. It does seem rather a terrible hassle though.

I'd probably settle for this quality actually:



I guess really end up being too close for the camera to handle it.

This is my digicam recording the same song at a different venue from a different position. This sounds better than the one I said I'd settle for..

Sorry, you are using a stills camera to record video?

That's rather like using a pair of pliars to cut paper. Wrong tool. Stills cameras are not designed for video, the electronics are all wrong. Likewise if I try and use my pro HD video camera to take stills, the results are crap.

You need something with a decent quality external mic. And you won't get that on a stills camera. All you'll get is a shitty mic costing no more than 30p which will overload easily and has bandwidth little better than a phone.

Here's a cheap video camera mic that will do the job (in mono natch) with any shitty camcorder that has a mic in socket.

http://www.studiospares.com/pd_417150_R ... HOTGUN.htm

Unless you are trying to do this covertly at the gig, in which case you are probably fucked unless you get one of the tiny Sony handcams and put up with the shitty internal mics (which will be better than a stills camera).

[hijack]My work has five digital voice recorders that I'm going to 'borrow' for a weekend, tape into the corners of my car and have a go at making some proper 5.1 surround sound with. It's not for anything important, I just want a go.
Am I being dumb?

That sounds ace Grim.... Will we get to sample your findings?

Aren't digital voice recorders going to give you horrible narrow bandwidth, compressed sound?

Dunno - I've never used one before. And yes, I'll share the (rubbish) results.

Yes. After alot of faffing around, the results will be shit due to the limited bandwidth. It's also not how they do proper surround sound. The work is usually done in the mix (which is why they've been able to remix Doctor Who episodes from the 80's into 5.1 because they have all the elements).

Oh. There me thinking it would be simple.

5.1 is fairly simple if you have the right software. It's hard to do well mind.

Halfway down this article, Mark Ayres explains how he remixed the final Doctor Who story to 5.1:

http://www.purpleville.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/rtwebsite/Survival.htm

What he ended up with was a 5.1 mix for a 18 year old TV show that blows most modern 5.1 TV mixes out of the water.

I like using my digicam to record and photo because it's rather handy doing both with one small device. I'm not after amazing sound quality.. just reasonable.. do any digicams not compress the audio?

Does your mobile not offer a sound recording facility? I'm not saying it will be any good, but it might be worth a go.

Well they are all going to have crap mics and because of storage space they are going to compress the hell out of the audio. They are designed for drunken nights out, not for any decent quality.

I always laugh when clients ask me how I get such good audio. I simply spend money on decent mics. It's really not rocket science.

This is my favourite lapel mic:

http://secure1.securesite.co.uk/soun973919/acatalog/ecm77b.html

and this is my handheld:

http://www.millennium-music.co.uk/home/products.pl?ProductCode=RODEM3&mode=detail&subcategory_id=CONDENSER+MICS

Both have dropped in price since I got mine. Rather wish I'd got an M5 looking at current prices but the M3 is a great unit with a lovely bottom end and the 77B is simply the industry standard for lapel mics (and again they have dropped in price heavily).

Don't suppose you could recommend a shitty camcorder with a mic-in? I'm actually having trouble finding one, though I dare say I'm looking in the wrong places as I haven't the first clue about video cameras.

Edit: My budget is 'as cheap as is humanly possible'.

Sorry, no idea. Unless you have £1400 as H Preston have an ex-display Sony A1E going begging.


http://www.videokit.co.uk/cgi-bin/store1/commerce.cgi?product=EX_DISPLAY_ITEMS&pid=2235.htm

Very very nice. It's the new HD version of my little PDX-10. Camcorder size but performence that comes close to some pro cameras. + it has XLR's so you can connect pro microphones to it.

Of no help to you of course. But Grim.. will probably buy several.

He might buy one - isn't that a two grand camera?

I own a 3310.

Usually about £1750. Part of that series where they sent a load of business people to Africa to help local communities last year was shot on A1E's. While still suffering from the problems that hit the PDX10, the images were still great.

That is a bloody good price and it has a Sony Silver Warrenty which is the package that comes with Sonys lower end pro cameras. I'm tempted myself except the A1E has a few problems that bother me, such as many of the controls being moved to the touch screen and the tapes being loaded from the bottom (which would be an arse when the camera is on a tripod). Since I mainly use my PDX10 (which an A1E would replace) at conferences, the bottom loading thing is the killer.

It is nice though and I still wouldn't be without my PDX10. And the lovely thing is that you can undock the sound module on the top and it just looks like a standard (but bulky) camcorder which means you can shoot without attracting the attention that a larger camera does. In fact if I did get an A1E it would indeed be because of the ability to get high quality images without the attention my Z1 attracts.

Good lord I thought I was the only person still using one of them!

I was tempted by that reduced camera but fact is I didn't need it. But thanks to a couple of new clients signing up and some invoices being paid I have treated myself to a Fig Rig:

http://www.creativevideo.co.uk/public/view_item_cat.php?catalogue_number=mn_595b

It's like a giant streering wheel where the camera goes in the middle. The ring basically helps you get better movement on the camera and less shake for handheld stuff.

Here's the item in question with its inventor:



And if you can't afford one, why not make one at home?