Be Excellent To Each Other

I know the red poppy is to support the RBL. What is the white poppy?

There seems to be conflicting info about it.

It's mainly offered by the Peace Pledge Union and other pacifist organisations as an alternative to perceived militarism of the red one.

My Form teacher from secondary school used to wear one, and she said they are essentially the same as the red poppies in that they symbolise respect for war dead and injured, but without the perceived "glamour" and patriotism that the red poppy can sometimes convey.

However, this was between 1987-1991 so it might be different now

She suggested wearing both if you wanted to.

Yes, the meaning is really up to the wearer, or indeed the non-wearer. Remembrance should be a personal act, not something done for show or to avoid criticism.

Indeed. Anyone who does hold forth an opinion on somebody else wearing or not wearing one is an arse.

I have some white poppies somewhere as I bought a pack of them one year. I don't like the way the red poppies have become some kind of political tool for far right groups to be fascist about.

I don't mind if you want to wear one though.

This image makes me uncomfortable, though.

Yes.

Growing up I always thought of the poppy as being an anti-war thing. I'll continue to do so even if I agree that some people who wear them don't quite see it the same way. Basically I like that people wear them even if I don't.

That's Stuart Campbell's recurring fever dream.

I've always considered that image to be fucking horrific, and symptomatic of the jingoistic nonsense that tends to surround military service these days.

I've got endless respect for those in the military, just as I have for people in other public service professions - but unlike nursing, care, teaching etc. I'm not convinced that we should be encouraging young'uns to join up for the armed forces.

I don't wear a poppy, but will (and do) happily contribute to the RBL during the Poppy Appeal. I purposely choose not to take/wear a poppy because of the bullshit that surrounds wearing one (or not wearing one) - especially if you're a public figure.

My grandfather stoppedwearing a poppy when he was about 87-90. I did ask him about it as he’d been in the Royal Legion and even back then (1997-2000ish, when I asked) he said that it was starting to be taken over by people who insisted that you had a duty to support all soldiers in all campaigns and that you stood unquestioningly by the British Army, which he disagreed with, as there were some terrible wars and some terrible military. He said he wore his proudly when it commemorates the war dead and the friends he lost, but as there were so few left now it was being hijacked by people trying to prove a point. So I never wore one that year and haven’t since.

I respect those that wear a poppy to remember those who made a sacrifice, by choice or not, to give freedom to the persecuted of Europe. I respect the white poppy campaign and have done since I was a teen. I suspect I’d wear one if I were more able to deal with possible verbal altercations in the street that might result, and I respect people like me that don’t wear one, because I can remember and pay respects to people like my grandfather without one and without material ‘proof’.

I refuse to wear a poppy. I chuck some change in the collection, (usually multiple times a year, but I don't mind)but make a point of refusing the poppy. None of the sellers have ever said anything about it.

How come?

I don't like the visibility of the poppy. At the end of the day, it's your personal choice whether to donate to charity or not. It's not just the poppy, I don't wear those stickers for other charities, I don't wear those ribbons.

I just don't feel that it's anyone elses business what causes I support. And that goes for anyone too, I don't want to know what charities Gary "Crispfucker" Lineker supports, nor do I care.

Two minute silences make me uncomfortable.

It's enforced respect but no other aspect than an email going round saying "for respect", and it's kind of weird. Not saying we shouldn't have it, but a lot of people aren't doing anything other than making sure their mobile phone is on silent and hoping they don't get a desk phone call during the two minutes.

I've started just working quietly through X minute silences, to be honest.

Tesco know how to do respect.

It is not a big ask, one day a year for a 2 min silence. Not sure it means less, as we have less and less people around from the 1st and 2nd world war.

Better not leave them in too long, people get angry when you burn poppies!

The two minutes silence is a tricky one. On the one hand, if you don't want to join in then don't. On the other, if you make a noise during that time and put other people off, that's a bit of a dick move. Which means staying silent.

So, um...

Briefly as I am struggling to word this clearly:

i think the two minute silence is important as part of the link between state and people. The state protects the people and it feels right that the people mourn those other people who died trying to uphold this.

That’s a joke... surely?

It’s the real reason toilet cubicles exist.

It’s not the only 2 minute silence many offices will get in a year, though. And there may be reasons to disagree with it, for some, I genuinely don’t know. Whether it’s a big ask almost certainly depends a great deal on whether you’re opposed to what the silence is being held for.

What if, for example, the silence in question was for the death of the monarch or other royal, and you were vehemently anti-monarchy. Though you have respect on death for that person as you would any other human, you disagree completely with the exalted status and ceremony the death of this one person born into priveledge is commanding. It may be a belief that is rooted in religious history, or your beliefs on class and equality, whatever. Then, maybe, it is a big ask. What do you do?

I’d say most people would go to the purpose-built toilet cubicle, but I can imagine that there are some people that object to SOME silences so much they would wish to openly defy it.

Ah. The sedition booth.

But if someone feels that strongly then they could make a statement and defy it. But they might then have to deal with a bunch of people who perhaps equally strongly wanted to observe it. They would just need to weigh up how much it mattered to them. It's pretty impossible to live in any kind of functioning society without sometimes feeling that you have to do things that you might not do if left to your own devices.

Never thought of it that way.

That’s pretty much what I was trying to say. I think there’s probably a tipping point where some people won’t want to sit silently... if you’re actually against the thing the silence is for, but I assume in most situations people would quietly ensure they weren’t at their desk whilst the silence was happening.

I think even if i did not agree with the silence, i would do it out of respect for the ones that do.

I think most people would do the same, especially in a work environment.

such respect so war dead wow

'Just lie back and think of England'

I assume we're all familiar with Poppy Watch on twitter? #TopRememberance

Put a quid in a box today, didn't take a poppy.

I've yet to see anyone selling them.

I got my enamel pin today at the hospital. Which is useful as I normally only get them due to the wife passing through Victoria or Charing Cross, which doesn’t happen any more.

How do we feel about this tweet from my son's teacher?

I guess it’s a bit clumsily worded. It makes it sound as if poppy purchase is mandatory. ‘If you wish to purchase a poppy in support of the poppy appeal then please send money with your child...’ etc would have been a much better wording, and I would hope any official line would say the same, but I guess this is just her personal account, and a 140 character limit.

Also, if they are standard sized sequins that’s a fairly large bit of poppy bling.

It's an official school account, but I think the teachers are pretty free in what they can post.

Provided they're "official" poppies and the money goes to the RBL I don't mind, but there's an increasing number of people selling poppy-themed merchandise with no indication as to whether any of the money goes to the actual cause.

The school wasn't selling actual poppies, but Slap Bands. Weird.

Yeah, those are for kids, as they don't get lost as easily. They've been about for a year or two.

Cool. I guess I'm getting a couple of those then, else my kids become playground outcasts.

What a world.

My son has a poppy wristband. It is more durable and involves less pins

Slap bands are cool. Especially branded ones from me.

Off we go again!

The nearby barber's display is slightly bigger than last year.



Eventually, people will have to fight their way in through a wall of poppies.