Be Excellent To Each Other

And, you know, party on. Dude.

All times are UTC [ DST ]




Reply to topic  [ 70 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 14:08 
User avatar
Bouncing Hedgehog

Joined: 27th Mar, 2008
Posts: 26064
Today I suddenly sprang to the realisation that Opus 40 by Mercury Rev...



Sounds just like All The Young Dudes by Mott The Hoople



Any other ahhhhhhhh moments in songs that you think you've heard?

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 15:06 
User avatar

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 14367
Location: Shropshire, UK
If I remember rightly, the melodies and backing tracks to most Will Smith songs are ripped off almost wholesale from other music, and the lyrics are just changed.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 15:07 
User avatar
Bouncing Hedgehog

Joined: 27th Mar, 2008
Posts: 26064
eggzamples, Gazchap, eggzamples!

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 15:15 
User avatar
Sleepyhead

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 27354
Location: Kidbrooke
GazChap wrote:
If I remember rightly, the melodies and backing tracks to most Will Smith songs are ripped off almost wholesale from other music, and the lyrics are just changed.


But they usually credit the original.

_________________
We are young despite the years
We are concern
We are hope, despite the times


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 15:22 
User avatar
Bouncing Hedgehog

Joined: 27th Mar, 2008
Posts: 26064
Isn't anyone going to tell me how right I amm about Mercury Rev and Hoople?!

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 15:25 
User avatar
Skillmeister

Joined: 27th Mar, 2008
Posts: 27023
Location: Felelagedge Wedgebarge, The River Tib

_________________
Washing Machine: Fine. Kettle: Needs De-scaling. Shower: Brand new. Boiler: Fine.
Archimedes Hotdog Rhubarb Niner Zero Niner.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 15:30 
User avatar
Time Out for Fun

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 5039
Location: South Shields
Mimi wrote:
eggzamples, Gazchap, eggzamples!


Miami.



Although it's just using samples which 99.9% of r'n'b and hip-hop uses.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 15:33 
Awesome
User avatar
Yes

Joined: 6th Apr, 2008
Posts: 12334
http://www.whosampled.com is a fascinating site for finding which songs have ripped off others.

_________________
Always proof read carefully in case you any words out


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 15:35 
User avatar
ugvm'er at heart...

Joined: 4th Mar, 2010
Posts: 22391
<refrains from mentioning the whole Oasis back catalogue>


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 15:37 
User avatar
Sleepyhead

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 27354
Location: Kidbrooke
Without playing them, I can't see too much in common of the choruses of Rev/Hoople.

Dunno about the verse as I can't remember ATYD well enough.

"Deserter's Songs" is one of my all time favourite albums. 'Endlessly' is amazing (and sounds like 'Silent Night').

_________________
We are young despite the years
We are concern
We are hope, despite the times


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 15:42 
User avatar
Bouncing Hedgehog

Joined: 27th Mar, 2008
Posts: 26064
Curiosity wrote:
Without playing them, I can't see too much in common of the choruses of Rev/Hoople.



Play them when you get home.

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 15:43 
User avatar
Time Out for Fun

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 5039
Location: South Shields
Wolf Parade apeing Black Sabbath War Pigs and Iron man at around 2.25



Arcade fire not playing Heart of Glass.



Great riff by Magazine...



or was it by Buzzcocks?



Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 15:46 
SupaMod
User avatar
Est. 1978

Joined: 27th Mar, 2008
Posts: 69713
Location: Your Mum
Baa Baa Black Sheep and Twinkle Twinkle Little Star.

_________________
Grim... wrote:
I wish Craster had left some girls for the rest of us.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 15:47 
User avatar
Bouncing Hedgehog

Joined: 27th Mar, 2008
Posts: 26064
noooo...

Twinkle Twinkle little star sounds far far more like the alphabet song.

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 15:50 
User avatar
Bouncing Hedgehog

Joined: 27th Mar, 2008
Posts: 26064
Mr Russell wrote:
http://www.whosampled.com is a fascinating site for finding which songs have ripped off others.


I didn't so much mean people who sampled other songs, but more bands that took a little bit too much 'inspiration' from other songs, perhaps?

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 15:51 
User avatar
Sleepyhead

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 27354
Location: Kidbrooke
Mary had a little lamb and London Bridge is falling down.

On a more sensible note, 'Uprising' by Muse and 'Call Me' by Blondie.

_________________
We are young despite the years
We are concern
We are hope, despite the times


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 15:54 
SupaMod
User avatar
Est. 1978

Joined: 27th Mar, 2008
Posts: 69713
Location: Your Mum
Curiosity wrote:
Mary had a little lamb and London Bridge is falling down.

I wan't even aware that Mary Had A Little Lamb had a tune :S

[edit]Oh.

_________________
Grim... wrote:
I wish Craster had left some girls for the rest of us.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 15:56 
User avatar
Ticket to Ride World Champion

Joined: 18th Apr, 2008
Posts: 11897
Curiosity wrote:
Mary had a little lamb and London Bridge is falling down.

On a more sensible note, 'Uprising' by Muse and 'Call Me' by Blondie.

yes, and the start is White collar boy by Belle and Sebastien.

_________________
No, it was a giant robot castle!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 15:57 
User avatar
Sleepyhead

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 27354
Location: Kidbrooke
Bobbyaro wrote:
Curiosity wrote:
Mary had a little lamb and London Bridge is falling down.

On a more sensible note, 'Uprising' by Muse and 'Call Me' by Blondie.

yes, and the start is White collar boy by Belle and Sebastien.


Oooooh, yes!

Also, 'Monument' by The Frames and 'Vaseline' by Stone Temple Pilots have the same guitar riff.

_________________
We are young despite the years
We are concern
We are hope, despite the times


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 16:01 
User avatar
Ticket to Ride World Champion

Joined: 18th Apr, 2008
Posts: 11897
vaseline, that the one I was trying to remember!

_________________
No, it was a giant robot castle!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 16:03 

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 5318
Chorus theft:





Not to mention the entire output of the Foo Fighters sounds like a narrow selection of Wildhearts stuff. They're complete phoneys. True story: After leaving East/West the Wildhearts signed for Mushroom. At roughly the same time Foo Fighters launched and the instruction from Mushroom high command was "you need to sound different to the Foo Fighters". Cue lots of drugs being taken and the release of Endless/Nameless, Ginger's "Metal Machine Music" and an album I really liked, you just couldn't get it airplay. Guess which poor bastard was on the PR team for that one?

I eventually went to work for a bank. This was one of the singles, featuring a 90's pop-rock proto bass-drop and deliberately produced to sound like it was being played in the next room. Awesome, but unsellable. I repeat, yes it is meant to sound like that. They spent a lot of time on it.



Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 16:07 
User avatar
Excellent Member

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 5924
Location: Stockport - The Jewel in the Ring
"I Think I'm Paranoid" by Garbage is "Bend Me, Shape Me" by the American Breed.

_________________
Mint To Be Stationery - Looking for a Secret Santa gift? Try our online shops at Mint To Be.

Book me in the Face | Tweet me. Tweet me like a British nanny.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 16:11 
User avatar
baron of techno

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 24136
Location: fife
Grim... wrote:
Curiosity wrote:
Mary had a little lamb and London Bridge is falling down.

I wan't even aware that Mary Had A Little Lamb had a tune :S

[edit]Oh.


This is Baa Baa Black Sheep:



I assume it is actually meant to be Baa Baa Black Sheep and not a coincidence though.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 16:12 

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 5318
While I remember, the same golden age of British music gave us Elastica:





(settled out of court)





(settled out of court) and...





Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 16:12 
User avatar
Ticket to Ride World Champion

Joined: 18th Apr, 2008
Posts: 11897
that turbonegro one is terrible!

_________________
No, it was a giant robot castle!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 16:27 

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 5318
It's been said :)


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 16:30 
User avatar
Hibernating Druid

Joined: 27th Mar, 2008
Posts: 49353
Location: Standing on your mother's Porsche
Status Quo.

Sorry Findus.

_________________
SD&DG Illustrated! Behance Bleep Bloop

'Not without talent but dragged down by bass turgidity'


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 16:35 
User avatar

Joined: 27th Mar, 2008
Posts: 14497
Damn it! I'm dead good at these but I can't remember any right now. Keep this thread open, yeah?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 16:41 
User avatar
Sleepyhead

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 27354
Location: Kidbrooke
WTB wrote:
Damn it! I'm dead good at these but I can't remember any right now. Keep this thread open, yeah?


Sooooooo tempted to lock the thread!

_________________
We are young despite the years
We are concern
We are hope, despite the times


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 16:45 
User avatar
Comfortably Dumb

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 12034
Location: Sunny Stoke
Zardoz wrote:
Status Quo.

Sorry Findus.


If we're including songs by the same band, Chuck Berry too. 'No Particular Place to Go' and 'School Day' for a start.

_________________
Consolemad | Under Logic
Curse, the day is long
Realise you don't belong


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 16:58 
User avatar
Excellent Member

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 5924
Location: Stockport - The Jewel in the Ring
Zardoz wrote:
Status Quo.

Sorry Findus.


Why do people complain about songs sounding they same when the band is called Status Quo?

_________________
Mint To Be Stationery - Looking for a Secret Santa gift? Try our online shops at Mint To Be.

Book me in the Face | Tweet me. Tweet me like a British nanny.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 17:00 
User avatar
ugvm'er at heart...

Joined: 4th Mar, 2010
Posts: 22391
I don't get why people complain about a band having the same sounding songs anyway. It doesn't happen with anything else, nobody was pissed off that the Harry Potter books all had the same people in them, for example.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 17:04 

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 5318
Plissken wrote:
Zardoz wrote:
Status Quo.

Sorry Findus.


Why do people complain about songs sounding they same when the band is called Status Quo?


Because all the songs should sound like Pictures of Matchstick Men.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 17:10 
User avatar
Bouncing Hedgehog

Joined: 27th Mar, 2008
Posts: 26064
Trooper wrote:
I don't get why people complain about a band having the same sounding songs anyway. It doesn't happen with anything else, nobody was pissed off that the Harry Potter books all had the same people in them, for example.


Er, those two things aren't even slightly related.

People complaining that bands always have the same band members in them would be like people moaning about the same characters in a book.

However, when the plots of films are all the same (The Matrix and sequels) then people mention it all of the time.

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 17:13 
User avatar
ugvm'er at heart...

Joined: 4th Mar, 2010
Posts: 22391
Mimi wrote:
Trooper wrote:
I don't get why people complain about a band having the same sounding songs anyway. It doesn't happen with anything else, nobody was pissed off that the Harry Potter books all had the same people in them, for example.


Er, those two things aren't even slightly related.

People complaining that bands always have the same band members in them would be like people moaning about the same characters in a book.

However, when the plots of films are all the same (The Matrix and sequels) then people mention it all of the time.


The plots of the Harry Potter books are all the same, basically.

People complaining that the author is always the same, would be the same as people complaining that the band always has the same members...


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 17:14 
User avatar
Comfortably Dumb

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 12034
Location: Sunny Stoke
GovernmentYard wrote:
Plissken wrote:
Zardoz wrote:
Status Quo.

Sorry Findus.


Why do people complain about songs sounding they same when the band is called Status Quo?


Because all the songs should sound like Pictures of Matchstick Men.


God no. I'm a Quo fan and while I like their early stuff, I'm not a fan of that one.

_________________
Consolemad | Under Logic
Curse, the day is long
Realise you don't belong


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 17:15 
User avatar
UltraMod

Joined: 27th Mar, 2008
Posts: 55719
Location: California
Curiosity wrote:
WTB wrote:
Damn it! I'm dead good at these but I can't remember any right now. Keep this thread open, yeah?


Sooooooo tempted to lock the thread!

Yeah, like you've worked out how to do that yet.

_________________
I am currently under construction.
Thank you for your patience.


Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 17:16 
User avatar
Sleepyhead

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 27354
Location: Kidbrooke
myp wrote:
Curiosity wrote:
WTB wrote:
Damn it! I'm dead good at these but I can't remember any right now. Keep this thread open, yeah?


Sooooooo tempted to lock the thread!

Yeah, like you've worked out how to do that yet.


*bans myp*

_________________
We are young despite the years
We are concern
We are hope, despite the times


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 17:19 
User avatar
Ticket to Ride World Champion

Joined: 18th Apr, 2008
Posts: 11897
hang on, WTF is curio a mod?? *flounces*

_________________
No, it was a giant robot castle!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 17:26 
Awesome
User avatar
Yes

Joined: 6th Apr, 2008
Posts: 12334
Supermassiveblackhole by Muse, and one of the more recent ones that Britney did sound awfully similar.

_________________
Always proof read carefully in case you any words out


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 17:34 
User avatar
UltraMod

Joined: 27th Mar, 2008
Posts: 55719
Location: California
Curiosity wrote:
myp wrote:
Curiosity wrote:
WTB wrote:
Damn it! I'm dead good at these but I can't remember any right now. Keep this thread open, yeah?


Sooooooo tempted to lock the thread!

Yeah, like you've worked out how to do that yet.


*bans myp*

Yeah, like you've worked out how to do that yet.

_________________
I am currently under construction.
Thank you for your patience.


Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 17:40 
User avatar
Sleepyhead

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 27354
Location: Kidbrooke
myp wrote:
Curiosity wrote:
myp wrote:
Curiosity wrote:
WTB wrote:
Damn it! I'm dead good at these but I can't remember any right now. Keep this thread open, yeah?


Sooooooo tempted to lock the thread!

Yeah, like you've worked out how to do that yet.


*bans myp*

Yeah, like you've worked out how to do that yet.


Challenge accepted!

_________________
We are young despite the years
We are concern
We are hope, despite the times


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 17:52 
SupaMod
User avatar
Commander-in-Cheese

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 49244
Myp had to have about 15 tries at it when he banned me.

_________________
GoddessJasmine wrote:
Drunk, pulled Craster's pork, waiting for brdyime story,reading nuts. Xz


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 17:56 
User avatar
Bouncing Hedgehog

Joined: 27th Mar, 2008
Posts: 26064
Trooper wrote:
Mimi wrote:
Trooper wrote:
I don't get why people complain about a band having the same sounding songs anyway. It doesn't happen with anything else, nobody was pissed off that the Harry Potter books all had the same people in them, for example.


Er, those two things aren't even slightly related.

People complaining that bands always have the same band members in them would be like people moaning about the same characters in a book.

However, when the plots of films are all the same (The Matrix and sequels) then people mention it all of the time.


The plots of the Harry Potter books are all the same, basically.

People complaining that the author is always the same, would be the same as people complaining that the band always has the same members...


No, that would be people complaining that the songwriter/composer was always the same person.

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 18:18 
User avatar
Time Out for Fun

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 5039
Location: South Shields
Super Furry Animals - Rings around the World



Daniel Johnston - Fake records of Rock and Roll



Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 18:19 
User avatar
Time Out for Fun

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 5039
Location: South Shields
devilman wrote:
GovernmentYard wrote:
Plissken wrote:
Zardoz wrote:
Status Quo.

Sorry Findus.


Why do people complain about songs sounding they same when the band is called Status Quo?


Because all the songs should sound like Pictures of Matchstick Men.


God no. I'm a Quo fan and while I like their early stuff, I'm not a fan of that one.


Strange it's the only Quo song I actually like.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 18:20 
User avatar
Hibernating Druid

Joined: 27th Mar, 2008
Posts: 49353
Location: Standing on your mother's Porsche
I like it I like it I like it I like it I la la la like it.

_________________
SD&DG Illustrated! Behance Bleep Bloop

'Not without talent but dragged down by bass turgidity'


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 19:28 
User avatar
UltraMod

Joined: 27th Mar, 2008
Posts: 55719
Location: California
Craster wrote:
Myp had to have about 15 tries at it when he banned me.

No, I successfully banned you each time, just you decided to use loopholes to get around it. You're the Zac Goldsmith of Beex.

_________________
I am currently under construction.
Thank you for your patience.


Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 19:55 
User avatar
Excellent Member

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 5924
Location: Stockport - The Jewel in the Ring
This takes a little bit of a listen, but I think the advert song is a bit familiar...



ZOMG Spoiler! Click here to view!


And, no, the band didn't know!

_________________
Mint To Be Stationery - Looking for a Secret Santa gift? Try our online shops at Mint To Be.

Book me in the Face | Tweet me. Tweet me like a British nanny.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Songs you one day realise are THE SAME
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 20:07 
SupaMod
User avatar
Commander-in-Cheese

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 49244
Curiosity wrote:
myp wrote:
Curiosity wrote:

*bans myp*

Yeah, like you've worked out how to do that yet.


Challenge accepted!


Turns out he does know how to ban people. Just...not how to unban people.

_________________
GoddessJasmine wrote:
Drunk, pulled Craster's pork, waiting for brdyime story,reading nuts. Xz


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Reply to topic  [ 70 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Columbo and 0 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search within this thread:
You are using the 'Ted' forum. Bill doesn't really exist any more. Bogus!
Want to help out with the hosting / advertising costs? That's very nice of you.
Are you on a mobile phone? Try http://beex.co.uk/m/
RIP, Owen. RIP, MrC. RIP, Dimmers.

Powered by a very Grim... version of phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group.