Be Excellent To Each Other

First off, I should make it clear that I'm personally still sticking by XP at the moment after some years of use, having never touched Vista apart from the fleeting moments when I have to help the folks out with various problems on their respective laptops. And what with 7 looming fast on the horizon and an increasing amount of backlash aimed at Vista in general, I'm less inclined to use it these days.

Doesn't anyone find it bizarre though that Vista is already supposedly being brushed aside when it still feels like it hasn't been out for that long? It's almost as if it's being regarded as a total accident, their Windows ME MK2. Am I on the ball with this one?

And how can we be sure that the same problems won't happen with 7 as well? Microsoft's track record seems to indicate that all of their Windows OSes have turned out to be faulty one way or another upon their initial debut, necessitating the need for a "Second Edition" or a new Service Pack. People left, right and centre have been singing the praises of 7 already, but I'm not too sure if I'd be willing to plunge straight into the deep end just yet if it turns out we're all acting as MS's public beta testers (and financially poorer beta testers at that) once more.

Lastly, compatibility with older/legacy software is still a major concern for me, particularly certain 95-era stuff that'll choke on newer material. Will it be the case in future that everyone will have to rely completely on DOSBox/Virtual-PC/VMware (and a decent top-end PC at that) to get their old-skool Windows kicks in future?


I look forward to your responses. :-)

If your PC is working fine, leave it how it is.

Vista was shite when they released it, and was only finally fixed properly in SP2. By then, its reputation was secure, nothing they did would sway popular opinion. Even then, stuff like UAC and some extraordinarily convoluted navigation of configuration options (resulting from making it "simpler") can make it a bit of a bastard.

But it's really not that bad now; Home Premium came on my newest laptop and I was sure I'd be replacing it with XP immediately, but I gave it a go and it's stuck. I'm still putting 7 on it though, possibly this weekend, having access to MSDN (and my own product key coming in October with the pre-order).

The difference here is that they listened, and focused on making it better. It's really mostly Vista SP3, with some genuine improvements to the underlying architecture (which Vista had as well), making UAC more bearable, and other UI work (like the systray) - and the wide availability of the Beta and RC have helped both the image and product.

Microsoft really dropped the ball with Vista, and they know it. 7 fixes a lot of Vistas problems and is a worthy successor to XP, from what most people are saying.

7 also has a "Virtual XP Mode" which ensures compatibility with system-friendly stuff that only runs under XP. They're definitely brushing Vista under the carpet.

That's what I was thinking with my Vista 64-bit, but seeing as I get a free upgrade to 7, it'd be churlish not to give it a whirl.

XP Mode will only be in Ultimate, not the Home editions, I think.

Run the Upgrade Advisor - if it tells you about unsolvable issues, don't install it. Easy.

I always wait for the first service pack before considering upgrading. That said, I wouldn't typically put a new O/S on an old PC. Given the typical life-span of the kit I buy it gets replaced every 3-5 years anyway and the new O/S comes pre-installed.

Thing is - it's mostly Vista, so is a very solid base. Combined with the wide Beta/RC releases, they've done a lot to circumvent the basis of that "rule".

I do think that Virtualization is the way forward - for instance on my Vista 64 box i have DOS 6.22 running in a VM so I can run a couple of ancient apps that I'm currently re-writing.

It's in Professional, primarily -- and then in Ultimate because Ultimate has all the features of the various versions. It's not in Home, you are correct.

XP Mode is nothing you can't do yourself with a free copy of VirtualPC or VMWare, of course.

If 7 is essentially Vista-but-better, I suppose that means its options layout will remain the same too? When I've been trying to help the folks out with stuff, I've often been flabbergasted by how much Vista has switched a lot of stuff around, especially in regards to stuff like the Control Panel, throwing me off course after having grown up around the general simplicity of 95/98 and then XP. I don't know if MS still allow the option to change the OS back to a "legacy" style layout to make things simpler and more familiar. Hopefully someone can confirm as such?

The "XP mode" sounds pretty snazzy though. So it's essentially an extravagantly extended Compatibility Mode function?

Lastly, I've read elsewhere that apparently Vista omitted the ability to change the MIDI driver in the Sound settings for some odd reason or another. Does 7 reinstate it, or will one need to rely on third-party tools once more?

Heh, cool - although surely DOSBox would've been a quicker alternative?

XP Mode is technically superior to those solutions as you don't actually have to manually launch a VM every time you want to use it, the system does it all for you and it acts as if it's a native window.

Do none of the Windows VM clients do a rootless window mode? I can do that on my Mac when it's running Windows apps via VMWare, why can't I do it when hosting on Windows?

Virtual PC doesn't in its current incarnation - but the version coming with 7 (aka XP Mode) does.

Yeah DOSbox probably would have worked fine too.

7 has some lovely features, and some annoying features. It's an OS.

For about 90% of my non-work computer use, Firefox is my OS. The other 10% is gaming.

Lots of mine is downloading stuff, copying files around, media center (sic), managing photo libraries, and fiddling about with stuff that I should have left at the office but didn't.

VirtualBox has a "seamless" mode.

It's not seamless.

It'd be nice (and hideously problematic, no doubt) if XP Mode did deep integration of stuff like user folders and that.

I quite like Win 7 even the wife does..

Like Bik said, run the compatability program..

Just because something's new, doesn't mean you have to upgrade to it.

Why?

When's 7 released?

I'm going to be purchasing a desktop soon, about month and a half - 2 months time. Will it be on most computers then?

22nd Oct.

It should be out in October so over a month away..

So I should wait until then and get one with 7 on it already? To save a load of hassle

If it aint broke don't fix it.

The only reason I'd be considering an upgrade is if the OS I already have doesn't do what I want/need.

What do you mean, "why"? Because it doesn't.
If something's working fine, why change it?

If a load of the software I currently used switched to Windows 7-only versions then I'd consider it, but for the foreseeable future, I don't see that happening.

Fuck that. Shit be new and shit.

Exactly, Win XP is great but it is old now...


I like the shininess of Win 7 and that it supports 64 bit

I know that... you in a funny mood today?

/scratches head

How is anyone meant to read your post and not think "Kovacs doesn't think XP does 64bit systems"?

Well it's hardly a plus point of 7, is it? Given that Vista and XP both support x64 too?

I like the new Audi R8 V10 because it has four wheels.

sorry I thought there were issues with XP64 and that Vista supported 64 better.. my bad if incorrect..

I dunno about you (or Kov), but I don't tend to sit & look at my OS & think that's lovely (other than when I changed my window manager to Compiz, but that's just a single part of the OS). As long as it does what I want with little or no fuss then I'm happy

SHIT BE NEW. AND SHIT.

IT TYPES BE BORED MOST OF THE TIME. NEED NEW THINGS TO BREAK PLAY WITH TEST. AND SHIT

Can't argue with that. I'm re-upping my OS X mainly because it's got a new cat on it.

I run XP. ran Vista for a few months, loathed it, run Linux for a while, and switched back to XP because I am too much of a gamer nerd to abandon my Windows-only games. [fuck WINE] Still have a partitioned hard drive to run Linux, and it's AWESOME.

I am suspicious of any new Windows products after the mess that Vista was. I think that unless 7 receives uniformly positive reviews, Ill be sticking with XP, thanks.

Are you *sure* that you're a girl?

I never got on with WINE. Installing XP in Virtual Box has significantly reduced the amount I need to boot into "proper" XP though.

I quite liked Vista... but Win 7 is better so far..

Teh first thing I do on a new windows install, any windows install, is turn off all the theme shit and make it looks like windows 98. No flashy fisher price graphics for me, no menus that slowly fade in, no stupid transparency, etc etc etc.

It's always a massive shcok when I use someone else's computer. I can't believe people use a computer in that state.

but the shiny stuff looks good. Win 9x looks so boring. I like the black theme on win7 and use zune on xp. Progress is good.

Some of the shiny stuff is quite useful, as it goes*. And I will admit to having grown... used to... Vista's look.

* Mini previews if you hover over a taskbar button, and the Windows+Tab graphical task switcher.