Yeah, Trump filling this slot on the court isn't a disaster, it's status quo. If Breyer or the Notorious RBG retire or die, then there's a big problem.
Jem wrote:
Too tired to argue with you dude... but welcome back
Curiosity wrote:
Also, Cavey! Lovely to see you!
You must have been having an absolute ball with the hot garbage of the Labour leadership election!
You must have been having an absolute ball with the hot garbage of the Labour leadership election!
Thanks mate.
No, even I've given up with the whole Labour thing (for now); it's beyond parody after all, and, although I loathe them for sure, even *I* have some sympathy for their hopeless plight. I guess I'm all out of laughs on that front - especially today.
Cavey wrote:
I disagree, Jem; if people are being stupid - by not even doing the most basic fact-checking and/or having zero critical faculties due to not being arsed and/or too deluded to even face the actual truth of a given situation, well, I'm sorry, but they deserve to be told they ARE stupid, to their faces.
Dude, you don't believe in global warming[1][2]. You've researched that yourself and found facts that support your argument, much like Leave / Trump voters (Lump voters! Perfect), and those are the fucking facts and no other facts or science will persuade you otherwise. That's just how a lot of people are.
Cavey wrote:
Why spare them the indignity of it, since it affects all of us? I've no time for irrational cults, or willful ignorance.
Too much facts and science seems to cause people everyone likes to storm off and not talk to us any more or come to play stupid drinking games
Although I've only got anecdotal evidence of that.[1] Or that humans are causing it, anyway
[2] Although people that live in fucking Florida just voted for a man who also doesn't, so Christ only knows what they're thinking
Heh. I'm a man made global climate change sceptic,precisely because no models that science has provided over the years and decades actually match what happens. So to my mind, just accepting a constantly goal post shifting bunch of assertions seems the stupid option, not my scepticism, especially given the horrendous economic damage being wrought and impact of to jobs etc. (Especially since the reality on the ground is basically just an exporting of carbon producing jobs away from our steelworks to China, with no net change to emissions at all)
Blindly going along with the fashion or zeitgeist without questioning is the easy, herd mentality option, but sorry, I don't give a shit what you, Gaywood or anyone else thinks. Show me a working , empirically validated model of the Earths climate taking all into account that actually predicts stuff accurately and proves man made CO2 is to blame, and not other factors, or GTFF with your corrupt billions in carbon trading and all the rest. End of.
I've made my position perfectly clear in the past, it is not a case of refusing to believe facts but actually the complete opposite: a refusal to believe something as read, in the absence of facts. Ironic huh? I believe it's known as having critical faculties.
(Constantly parroting '3 gazillion scientists think climate change is man-made' is not conclusive evidence and isn't a substitute for a working, validated computer climate model that reflects reality and proves climate change is made made, either. Those same gazillions of scientists would've scoffed at the idea of an accelerative expanding universe, dark energy and the apparent breaking of the Second Law of Thermodynamics 20 years ago - until empirally proved - and were then *forced* to redevelop theories to fit the facts, after the fact. Same goes for "hot Jupiters" as well, even 10 years back - until these were actually observed orbiting very close to neighboring stars and, once again, long-held standard planetary and gravitic models had to be binned, right back to absolute fundamentals. You know, the first thing a Scientist (or Engineer) must possess is an open mind, and then the upmost respect for the sanctity of inarguable empirical data and validation, repeatability, testing of models and sweeping assertions. Something to bear in mind, I feel).
Blindly going along with the fashion or zeitgeist without questioning is the easy, herd mentality option, but sorry, I don't give a shit what you, Gaywood or anyone else thinks. Show me a working , empirically validated model of the Earths climate taking all into account that actually predicts stuff accurately and proves man made CO2 is to blame, and not other factors, or GTFF with your corrupt billions in carbon trading and all the rest. End of.
I've made my position perfectly clear in the past, it is not a case of refusing to believe facts but actually the complete opposite: a refusal to believe something as read, in the absence of facts. Ironic huh? I believe it's known as having critical faculties.
(Constantly parroting '3 gazillion scientists think climate change is man-made' is not conclusive evidence and isn't a substitute for a working, validated computer climate model that reflects reality and proves climate change is made made, either. Those same gazillions of scientists would've scoffed at the idea of an accelerative expanding universe, dark energy and the apparent breaking of the Second Law of Thermodynamics 20 years ago - until empirally proved - and were then *forced* to redevelop theories to fit the facts, after the fact. Same goes for "hot Jupiters" as well, even 10 years back - until these were actually observed orbiting very close to neighboring stars and, once again, long-held standard planetary and gravitic models had to be binned, right back to absolute fundamentals. You know, the first thing a Scientist (or Engineer) must possess is an open mind, and then the upmost respect for the sanctity of inarguable empirical data and validation, repeatability, testing of models and sweeping assertions. Something to bear in mind, I feel).
Also, I was sorry as anyone to miss the Cottage I love you guys. But as I explained privately to Curio, you gotta draw the line and the last bout of crap was off the scale, I just can't risk stuff like that in my life.
On the topic of climate change, Trump announces the head of his transition team for the EPA
Oh.
Quote:
Ebell, who was dubbed an “elegant nerd” and a “policy wonk” by Vanity Fair, is known for his prolific writings that question what he calls climate change “alarmism.” He appears frequently in the media and before Congress. He’s also chairman of the Cooler Heads Coalition, a group of nonprofits that “question global warming alarmism and oppose energy-rationing policies.”
Ebell appears to relish criticism from the left.
In a biography submitted when he testified before Congress, he listed among his recognitions that he had been featured in a Greenpeace “Field Guide to Climate Criminals,” dubbed a “misleader” on global warming by Rolling Stone and was the subject of a motion to censure in the British House of Commons after Ebell criticized the United Kingdom’s chief scientific adviser for his views on global warming.
More recently, Ebell has called the Obama administration’s Clean Power Plan for greenhouse gases illegal and said that Obama joining the Paris climate treaty “is clearly an unconstitutional usurpation of the Senate’s authority.”
Ebell appears to relish criticism from the left.
In a biography submitted when he testified before Congress, he listed among his recognitions that he had been featured in a Greenpeace “Field Guide to Climate Criminals,” dubbed a “misleader” on global warming by Rolling Stone and was the subject of a motion to censure in the British House of Commons after Ebell criticized the United Kingdom’s chief scientific adviser for his views on global warming.
More recently, Ebell has called the Obama administration’s Clean Power Plan for greenhouse gases illegal and said that Obama joining the Paris climate treaty “is clearly an unconstitutional usurpation of the Senate’s authority.”
Oh.
Attachment:
GK03e0Bs.jpg
Interesting picture. Republican numbers stayed pretty much the same as the last few times, Democrat numbers were 10 million votes down on Obama's first term.
It was a "Not Hillary" result, rather than a "Trump" result.
@cavey My point wasn't about climate change , it was more about people not wanting to change their mind especially when it's easy to find information to support their original position.
Blimmin eck, but that's an interesting chart, Trooper - I'd be interested to see how many Obama gained, mind, but it still shows a powerful 'oh god, is that the best you can do for us?' (and also 'what? a woman?') push.
Trooper wrote:
Attachment:
GK03e0Bs.jpg
Interesting picture. Republican numbers stayed pretty much the same as the last few times, Democrat numbers were 10 million votes down on Obama's first term.
It was a "Not Hillary" result, rather than a "Trump" result.
Oh.
MaliA wrote:
there's a strong possibility that support the democrats thought was there didn't appear like on 2012.
MaliA wrote:
It seems that a surge if support from minority groups did not reach levels enough to counterbalance the redneck vote.
Cavey wrote:
Also, I was sorry as anyone to miss the Cottage I love you guys. But as I explained privately to Curio, you gotta draw the line and the last bout of crap was off the scale, I just can't risk stuff like that in my life.
Shame dude, it was a great weekend.
JBR wrote:
Blimmin eck, but that's an interesting chart, Trooper - I'd be interested to see how many Obama gained, mind, but it still shows a powerful 'oh god, is that the best you can do for us?' (and also 'what? a woman?') push.
Obama gained massively. Hillary's result was far more normal, though a little low. Obama got, I think, the most votes ever.
Curiosity wrote:
JBR wrote:
Blimmin eck, but that's an interesting chart, Trooper - I'd be interested to see how many Obama gained, mind, but it still shows a powerful 'oh god, is that the best you can do for us?' (and also 'what? a woman?') push.
Obama gained massively. Hillary's result was far more normal, though a little low. Obama got, I think, the most votes ever.
Yeah so I guess you can discount the disaffected white working class and just go back to blaming ALL white people (in the world).
This is a windup now. Ben Carson for Secretary of Education? The man who thought the Great Pyramids were grain stores?!
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/peopl ... 10006.html
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/peopl ... 10006.html
Send him your CV I case he needs a Secretary of Grenades.
Cras wrote:
This is a windup now. Ben Carson for Secretary of Education? The man who thought the Great Pyramids were grain stores?!
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/peopl ... 10006.html
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/peopl ... 10006.html
Sarah Palin?
America...
https://twitter.com/ditzkoff/status/796828408038694912
An Open Flame being considered for Secretary of Gasoline
— Dave Itzkoff (@ditzkoff) November 10, 2016
Quote:
An Open Flame being considered for Secretary of Gasoline
Doctor Glyndwr wrote:
Because both subjects will come up in Curio's Cottage Cuiz next year.
I thought we were goig to shake our heads in disageement if Trump supporterd took to the streets dissatisfied with the result. Now, I'm conflicted.
Anyway, there were some people on R4 this morning who said that they voted for The T-Dawg as he was loads pro business and even The Unions were up for him. The walls and anti islam stuff was pushed way down the list of Important Stuff That Matters but it was not clear if this was jus a polite thing to say. A lot had previously voted for democrat but felt forgotten by Obama and his promise to look over NAFTA which they feel is detrimental to them.
Tjey also had a Republican woman on who said tjat women are not just single issue creatures which is a fair point but she was well in the GOP fold.
Anyway, there were some people on R4 this morning who said that they voted for The T-Dawg as he was loads pro business and even The Unions were up for him. The walls and anti islam stuff was pushed way down the list of Important Stuff That Matters but it was not clear if this was jus a polite thing to say. A lot had previously voted for democrat but felt forgotten by Obama and his promise to look over NAFTA which they feel is detrimental to them.
Tjey also had a Republican woman on who said tjat women are not just single issue creatures which is a fair point but she was well in the GOP fold.
Personally I'm not really terribly conflicted about having different feelings over protests for or against a dangerous, racist dickhead being elected president.
markg wrote:
Personally I'm not really terribly conflicted about having different feelings over protests for or against a dangerous, racist dickhead being elected president.
Well, yes, but I do wonder how long the first amendment will last in the face of it.
I can't decide if letting Mr Trump use his powers is scarier than having him spend his term playing golf and enjoying 'being President' whilst the hardline rightists in his cabinet and in Congress get on with the business of government.
Mr Dave wrote:
markg wrote:
Personally I'm not really terribly conflicted about having different feelings over protests for or against a dangerous, racist dickhead being elected president.
Well, yes, but I do wonder how long the first amendment will last in the face of it.
One court appointment.
Mr Dave wrote:
markg wrote:
Personally I'm not really terribly conflicted about having different feelings over protests for or against a dangerous, racist dickhead being elected president.
Well, yes, but I do wonder how long the first amendment will last in the face of it.
markg wrote:
It's a worry but on the other hand will the protests last until he is actually president? I think it's a lot of anger mixed with a bit of denial. People will realise that it's not going to change anything, that he is going to be president. Possibly the worst one ever but still just another president, they'll regroup and they'll fight him properly. At least that's what I hope.
We got through eight years of George W Bush.
As for worst president, well, on the grounds that it's unfair to include William H Harrison, then probably James Buchanan. Did fuck all whilst the country fell apart, and even told his successor he was glad to be leaving. Wilson was a heck of a racist shit, but was right about the 14 Points.
I think, also, that the media and whatnot really need to learn tbat tbe US is not the progressive, liberal country they think it is. It lags behind Poland and Ireland I think on abortion and death penalty issues.
Thing is, with most politicians , they seem to fight for what they think is right, and will make the place better (you may disagree with them on the why's and how's, but still)
With Trump, you just don't see that. This was entirely just about his name.
With Trump, you just don't see that. This was entirely just about his name.
MaliA wrote:
I think, also, that the media and whatnot really need to learn tbat tbe US is not the progressive, liberal country they think it is. It lags behind Poland and Ireland I think on abortion and death penalty issues.
Yeah but it varies massively. Parts of it might as well be separate countries. MaliA wrote:
I think, also, that the media and whatnot really need to learn tbat tbe US is not the progressive, liberal country they think it is. It lags behind Poland and Ireland I think on abortion and death penalty issues.
While I agree with your wider point, the US very much does not lag behind Ireland on abortion.
Not yet.
Roe v Wade is safe unless a second SC seat opens up during Trump's term.
Mr Dave wrote:
With Trump, you just don't see that. This was entirely just about his name.
I'm curious to find out how he actually copes with the game of politics. It isn't like business, after all, and the US system is set up to frustrate the actions of anyone wanting to do anything.
Cras wrote:
MaliA wrote:
I think, also, that the media and whatnot really need to learn tbat tbe US is not the progressive, liberal country they think it is. It lags behind Poland and Ireland I think on abortion and death penalty issues.
While I agree with your wider point, the US very much does not lag behind Ireland on abortion.
True, but there's an awful lot of energy expended trying to get behind Ireland on it. There's also the emoyment laws, etc, etc. But anyways.
Kern wrote:
Mr Dave wrote:
With Trump, you just don't see that. This was entirely just about his name.
I'm curious to find out how he actually copes with the game of politics. It isn't like business, after all, and the US system is set up to frustrate the actions of anyone wanting to do anything.
markg wrote:
I honestly think he'll retire on the grounds of ill-health at some point.
Two words: President Pence. *shudders*
Kern wrote:
markg wrote:
I honestly think he'll retire on the grounds of ill-health at some point.
Two words: President Pence. *shudders*
He was cent there at the wrong dime.
MaliA wrote:
Kern wrote:
markg wrote:
I honestly think he'll retire on the grounds of ill-health at some point.
Two words: President Pence. *shudders*
He was cent there at the wrong dime.
No, we're talking money; dollars; taxes.
Kern wrote:
MaliA wrote:
Kern wrote:
markg wrote:
I honestly think he'll retire on the grounds of ill-health at some point.
Two words: President Pence. *shudders*
He was cent there at the wrong dime.
No, we're talking money; dollars; taxes.
My mate lived next city over, in Austin.
markg wrote:
MaliA wrote:
I think, also, that the media and whatnot really need to learn tbat tbe US is not the progressive, liberal country they think it is. It lags behind Poland and Ireland I think on abortion and death penalty issues.
Yeah but it varies massively. Parts of it might as well be separate countries.Technically, they are. 50 of them.
DavPaz wrote:
markg wrote:
MaliA wrote:
I think, also, that the media and whatnot really need to learn tbat tbe US is not the progressive, liberal country they think it is. It lags behind Poland and Ireland I think on abortion and death penalty issues.
Yeah but it varies massively. Parts of it might as well be separate countries.Technically, they are. 50 of them.
Yeah, try to tell me that MA, NY, CA and WA aren't progressive, I'll laugh in your face. The coasts are generally fine, it's the huge part in the middle which is the problem.
Funny how a supposedly antiestablishment and anti-globalisation candidate seems to filling his cabinet with establishment hyper-capitalists. It's almost like...
Lonewolves wrote:
DavPaz wrote:
markg wrote:
MaliA wrote:
I think, also, that the media and whatnot really need to learn tbat tbe US is not the progressive, liberal country they think it is. It lags behind Poland and Ireland I think on abortion and death penalty issues.
Yeah but it varies massively. Parts of it might as well be separate countries.Technically, they are. 50 of them.
Yeah, try to tell me that MA, NY, CA and WA aren't progressive, I'll laugh in your face. The coasts are generally fine, it's the huge part in the middle which is the problem.
California and Washington still have the death penalty which I don't consider to terribly forward. California voted to keep it this week, and a moratorium has only been in place in Washington for a couple of years. Federal crimes can e met with death in Massachusetts, too.
Hero of Excellence wrote:
Funny how a supposedly antiestablishment and anti-globalisation candidate seems to filling his cabinet with establishment hyper-capitalists. It's almost like...
Wasn't the California vote on the death penalty worded really weirdly to make it seem like you'd be voting to get rid but you were actually voting in favour? Dunno if it was CA, but it was one of them where the wording was awful.
MaliA wrote:
Lonewolves wrote:
DavPaz wrote:
markg wrote:
MaliA wrote:
I think, also, that the media and whatnot really need to learn tbat tbe US is not the progressive, liberal country they think it is. It lags behind Poland and Ireland I think on abortion and death penalty issues.
Yeah but it varies massively. Parts of it might as well be separate countries.Technically, they are. 50 of them.
Yeah, try to tell me that MA, NY, CA and WA aren't progressive, I'll laugh in your face. The coasts are generally fine, it's the huge part in the middle which is the problem.
California and Washington still have the death penalty which I don't consider to terribly forward. California voted to keep it this week, and a moratorium has only been in place in Washington for a couple of years. Federal crimes can e met with death in Massachusetts, too.
All that, and you can't even buy beer in a Pennsylvanian supermarket!
Another blue state, Colorado, rejected single payer healthcare on Tuesday, not very progressive IMO.
Kern wrote:
MaliA wrote:
Lonewolves wrote:
DavPaz wrote:
markg wrote:
MaliA wrote:
I think, also, that the media and whatnot really need to learn tbat tbe US is not the progressive, liberal country they think it is. It lags behind Poland and Ireland I think on abortion and death penalty issues.
Yeah but it varies massively. Parts of it might as well be separate countries.Technically, they are. 50 of them.
Yeah, try to tell me that MA, NY, CA and WA aren't progressive, I'll laugh in your face. The coasts are generally fine, it's the huge part in the middle which is the problem.
California and Washington still have the death penalty which I don't consider to terribly forward. California voted to keep it this week, and a moratorium has only been in place in Washington for a couple of years. Federal crimes can e met with death in Massachusetts, too.
All that, and you can't even buy beer in a Pennsylvanian supermarket!
Well, quite. Savages.
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