Be Excellent To Each Other :: View topic - Bits and Bobs 22

I didn't know that about paint. Interesting stuff that.

Black is particularly bad for this, apparently.

Bastard.

How the hell did you swing that one, Zarzipan?

markh wrote:

Can't this be split into a pedantic arguments thread or sub-forum? On the moon.

For the first time ever, I've just skipped a load of B&B.

Zardoz wrote:

Also: I've just been offered a 4 day trip to Dubai with work all expenses paid staying at the Kempinski and taking in a dessert safari and other stuff.

I went on dessert safari once, I bagged a cheesecake and three eclairs.

You spawny, spawny bastard. Do you actually have to do anything work-related while you're there?

DavPaz wrote:

markh wrote:

Can't this be split into a pedantic arguments thread or sub-forum? On the moon.

For the first time ever, I've just skipped a load of B&B.

LOL, just seen this.

I must admit, this sentiment does make me chuckle. A reasonably informed argument as to origins of pretty much the worst financial crisis this country has ever known (at least in living memory), with quite a few of the (dare I say) more cerebral Beexers contributing, is but a 'pedantic argument' worthy only of binning off somewhere in mid stream? Of course, what we really need here is a proper discussion about 'gippies' and Facebook. Yes.

(Yeah I know it's B&B; I've no problem with splitting out a concerted, focused discussion into a more appropriate thread as it develops, per se, but minus the derisory comments though).

If you think that was intelligent debate fine, in the appropriate thread, knock yourself out.

For me personally it was you and a few others whom are not going to be convinced any other way regardless of how long you keep going at each other, grinding on and on in the same way making the same points you have been making since time begun.

I dunno, even though the arguers were entrenched I learned a few things (possibly).

Any discussion on a particular topic tends to get split once it starts to dominate, no matter if it's light or serious, just because.

No cause to be moaning about anything really

Zio, you might need to manage his expectations a bit.
How long you think it would take to write the docs even if you did have all the information? What estimate of work did you give when assigned this task?

It may be a test. If you bust a nut over the weekend trying to do the impossible, you're only going to get given more impossible tasks in the future.

I'm glad you learned a few new things, however I anticipate you flying off the handle and stomping off in the same way within a fortnight max.
C'est la vie, i'll just add your 'cerebral' musings to ignore from now on - it's probably for the best and will save me your passive/aggressive non-ending responses 'old chap'

They pretty clearly don't have a clue about documentation if they haven't bothered doing any up to now. Hopefully you've outlined the scale of the task, and that the draft is going to be very "drafty" with such a short (and presumably arbitrary) deadline.

You need to begin with a 'what's up.doc'.

DavPaz wrote:

markh wrote:

Can't this be split into a pedantic arguments thread or sub-forum? On the moon.

For the first time ever, I've just skipped a load of B&B.

LOL, just seen this.

SNIP

Captain Caveman wrote:

DavPaz wrote:

markh wrote:

Can't this be split into a pedantic arguments thread or sub-forum? On the moon.

For the first time ever, I've just skipped a load of B&B.

LOL, just seen this.

SNIP

Hey Cavey, I've never had a problem with you in any way, in fact I enjoy your hugely overlong arguing style and amusing style of condescension, but this has massively dropped my opinion of you. I'm usually the first to call for a split of a conversation out of B&B, mainly to ensure that it doesn't get lost under the tedious 'gippes' and Facebook nonsense, not because it's not cerebral or interesting. But fuck me, man, insulting large swathes of the forumites in one post like was immensely impressive.

I tell you what, us kids will go and play in the yard. You tool.

Zardoz wrote:

You need to begin with a 'what's up.doc'.

Sorry if I pissed you off here.

Captain Caveman wrote:

Sorry if I pissed you off here.

Hey, I'm usually pretty easy going, but something about the tone of your reply really ranckled* me. The reason I agreed with the split is B&B just isn't the place for an argument with *references*

Apology accepted and offered in return**.

*is that a word? I thought it was.
** sorry, drama fans.

Also - best quango ever: Government Hospitality Advisory Committee on the Purchase of Wines. This must be saved. MUST.

DavPaz wrote:

Captain Caveman wrote:

DavPaz wrote:

markh wrote:

Can't this be split into a pedantic arguments thread or sub-forum? On the moon.

For the first time ever, I've just skipped a load of B&B.

LOL, just seen this.

SNIP

Aw come off it man, lighten up. You'll have to admit, markh's post was a bit shitty and uncalled for, no? I just gave him a taste of his own medicine, and now he's predictably and very impressively gone off in a huff. Hell, I wasn't even thinking of you here at all and think you're a good guy, as it goes. I'm glad I make you and others chuckle; that's pretty much 90% of the point of my being here in the first place.

Sorry if I pissed you off here.

British Nuclear Fuels

Oh right, I was thinking of the other lot, the ones that are supposedly vetting these new nuke plants.

Author:	MrChris [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 10:52 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
DBSnappa wrote: I didn't know that about paint. Interesting stuff that. Indeed - I hadn't been aware of this until recently, when I asked our chippy why some of the paint on the porch was bubbling. Black is particularly bad for this, apparently. We've since found some lovely water-permeable woodpaint from a local hippy shop. Relatedly, we've had one of the dormer windows in the roof replaced as the frame had rotted to hell. Mrs K has said it now makes the other one look a bit tired... sigh.

Author:	kalmar [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 11:00 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
Mr Kissyfur wrote: Black is particularly bad for this, apparently. Most dark colours have extra problems due to getting much hotter in the sun, so that's an extra consideration for any south facing woodwork.

Author:	Zardoz [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 11:10 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
flis wrote: Bastard. How the hell did you swing that one, Zarzipan? Hard grafting and good looks.

Author:	Bobbyaro [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 11:12 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
No, really, how?

Author:	markg [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 11:13 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
You spawny, spawny bastard. Do you actually have to do anything work-related while you're there?

Be Excellent To Each Other https://www.beexcellenttoeachother.com/forum/

Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks https://www.beexcellenttoeachother.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=6270	Page 47 of 60

Author:	Cavey [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 11:22 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
DavPaz wrote: markh wrote: Can't this be split into a pedantic arguments thread or sub-forum? On the moon. For the first time ever, I've just skipped a load of B&B. LOL, just seen this. I must admit, this sentiment does make me chuckle. A reasonably informed argument as to origins of pretty much the worst financial crisis this country has ever known (at least in living memory), with quite a few of the (dare I say) more cerebral Beexers contributing, is but a 'pedantic argument' worthy only of binning off somewhere in mid stream? Of course, what we really need here is a proper discussion about 'gippies' and Facebook. Yes. (Yeah I know it's B&B; I've no problem with splitting out a concerted, focused discussion into a more appropriate thread as it develops, per se, but minus the derisory comments though).

Author:	Cavey [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 11:23 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
Good show, Zarz - have fun mate.

Author:	Zardoz [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 11:26 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
Doctor Glyndwr wrote: Zardoz wrote: Also: I've just been offered a 4 day trip to Dubai with work all expenses paid staying at the Kempinski and taking in a dessert safari and other stuff. I went on dessert safari once, I bagged a cheesecake and three eclairs. You win. But I still have a HUGE shit eating grin on my face.

Author:	Zardoz [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 11:31 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
markg wrote: You spawny, spawny bastard. Do you actually have to do anything work-related while you're there? Not really. I'll take some photos.

Author:	markh [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 11:34 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
If you think that was intelligent debate fine, in the appropriate thread, knock yourself out. For me personally it was you and a few others whom are not going to be convinced any other way regardless of how long you keep going at each other, grinding on and on in the same way making the same points you have been making since time begun. Captain Caveman wrote: DavPaz wrote: markh wrote: Can't this be split into a pedantic arguments thread or sub-forum? On the moon. For the first time ever, I've just skipped a load of B&B. LOL, just seen this. I must admit, this sentiment does make me chuckle. A reasonably informed argument as to origins of pretty much the worst financial crisis this country has ever known (at least in living memory), with quite a few of the (dare I say) more cerebral Beexers contributing, is but a 'pedantic argument' worthy only of binning off somewhere in mid stream? Of course, what we really need here is a proper discussion about 'gippies' and Facebook. Yes. (Yeah I know it's B&B; I've no problem with splitting out a concerted, focused discussion into a more appropriate thread as it develops, per se, but minus the derisory comments though).

Author:	kalmar [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 11:38 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
I dunno, even though the arguers were entrenched I learned a few things (possibly). Any discussion on a particular topic tends to get split once it starts to dominate, no matter if it's light or serious, just because. No cause to be moaning about anything really

Author:	Malabelm [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 11:39 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
Ah, clients. One is now complaining that their new site isn't a roaring success. It's been live for four days, and they haven't marketed it in the slightest. They have four registered users. Part of the search is also not entirely reliable. Of course, this is our fault, despite telling them their data is wildly incomplete and out of date. Woo!

Author:	Cras [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 11:40 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
It's a shame phpBB has such a fucking annoying admin interface for splits. You go through the whole thing selecting which posts you want to move, then it goes "ah, but you didn't put in a topic number to move them to - go do that now. Oh, I've also unticked all your choices for you, because I'm like that. You may want to go do that again".

Author:	Bobbyaro [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 11:43 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
Put the topic number in first.

Author:	Zio [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 11:51 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
Second week in new job. This is so much better than what I was doing before, but I'm slowly learning that my new boss is quite the harsh task-master. Basically, this department has done absolutely bugger all documentation about anything at all ever, and, having finally realised this may be a problem, have hired me as a kind of technical author. Yesterday morning I was given my first project: to provide complete documentation for the build process of the Windows 7 disc image they're rolling out to all staff PCs. This not only means writing up the actual process, but creating testing documentation to something approaching the IEEE 829 specification, involving writing up the plan they should have been following, all the test cases, results, the logs, everything. This means having to arrange meetings with everyone involved and praying they can remember something about the testing they did, when they did it and what their findings were. Then I've got to get them to sign off that they're happy the testing is complete. Then I've got to write it up. Again: this is the complete project they went through to upgrade from Windows XP to Windows 7 across all users of a national company including all the testing they did on all the many apps they use to make sure they would still work perfectly. They've done the testing and the builds, they know it works, but they've documented absolutely none of it. And they did all of this long before I even started here. I could drone on, but basically it's like this: I'm new here and know nothing. Before I can write this up, I need to know everything. Just a second ago, the boss looked straight at me and said: "Windows 7 docs. Done yet?". "No." "Right. Have them done by Monday afternoon though, yeah?" Arrrggggghhhhhh!

Author:	MaliA [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:24 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
When I had to write technical computery user guides I spent most of the time doing screen grabs and using big red arrows pointing the things to press. It worked quite well, in the end, as people seemed to be able to grasp the software, despite it being less user friendly than EvE's.

Author:	Kern [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:29 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
Before I left my old job I wrote a lenghty document detailing all the IT systems we used. I sneaked the ever helpful XKCD Tech Support chart into it after getting sick of showing people how to use the printer.

Author:	MrChris [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 11:54 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
Managing expectations is the key, Zio.

Author:	Cavey [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 11:55 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
Quote: If you think that was intelligent debate fine, in the appropriate thread, knock yourself out. Well yes, I do think that was intelligent debate, yes. As regards the 'appropriate thread', the discussion was started here by others and developed from there, as it so often does. I've no issue with splitting out per se, as I've already mentioned (although personally I can't see the supposed big deal about it, with the usual suspects demanding said splitting at the earliest possibility). It's just the accompanying derogatory comments in your case. Still, it's always nice to have your permission to 'knock ourselves out', I feel so much better now. Quote: For me personally it was you and a few others whom are not going to be convinced any other way regardless of how long you keep going at each other, grinding on and on in the same way making the same points you have been making since time begun. You're entitled to your opinion, though I certainly wouldn't describe the discussion in such terms. Personally speaking, I learned a few new things from intelligent, informed people. Still, I await your doubtless awesome contributions in earnest from now on, with baited breath - I'm sure you'll show the likes of Peter St.John, Doc G, Mr K, Craster, Malia and myself how to really conduct an intelligent debate here. Heck, I'll be sure to critique comprehensively and return the compliment, either way.. (Can't say I can rememer anything whatsoever from you in the past though, frankly).

Author:	kalmar [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 11:55 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
Zio, you might need to manage his expectations a bit. How long you think it would take to write the docs even if you did have all the information? What estimate of work did you give when assigned this task? It may be a test. If you bust a nut over the weekend trying to do the impossible, you're only going to get given more impossible tasks in the future.

Author:	Cavey [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 11:58 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
kalmar wrote: I dunno, even though the arguers were entrenched I learned a few things (possibly). Any discussion on a particular topic tends to get split once it starts to dominate, no matter if it's light or serious, just because. No cause to be moaning about anything really Oh sure mate, no bothered about the splitting aspect at all. Just the rude, derogatory comments.

Author:	kalmar [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:00 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
Yeah, I meant, no need for people to be moaning about you guys discussing it. IMHO.

Author:	markh [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:01 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
I'm glad you learned a few new things, however I anticipate you flying off the handle and stomping off in the same way within a fortnight max. C'est la vie, i'll just add your 'cerebral' musings to ignore from now on - it's probably for the best and will save me your passive/aggressive non-ending responses 'old chap'

Author:	Zio [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:02 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
kalmar wrote: Zio, you might need to manage his expectations a bit. How long you think it would take to write the docs even if you did have all the information? What estimate of work did you give when assigned this task? It may be a test. If you bust a nut over the weekend trying to do the impossible, you're only going to get given more impossible tasks in the future. Ah, it'll be fine, just thought it was quite funny. I've arranged meetings for this afternoon and Monday morning that will give me enough info to knock up something and I've told the boss that he can have a draft based on those before the end of Monday afternoon, but that it'll take a few days to actually complete. I reckon it's a test myself. If he believes I can do that level of work that quickly, I'd be able to get all the department's docs done in a few months. They've hired me for the whole year and I know from speaking to others here that no-one really believes things will be done even in that time-frame.

Author:	Cavey [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:03 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
markh wrote: I'm glad you learned a few new things, however I anticipate you flying off the handle and stomping off in the same way within a fortnight max. C'est la vie, i'll just add your 'cerebral' musings to ignore from now on - it's probably for the best and will save me your passive/aggressive non-ending responses 'old chap' Great, your having me on ignore will mean I won't have to endure your petty, idiotic, rude and above all worthless interventions in future. Everyone's a winner, old chap.

Author:	kalmar [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:03 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
They pretty clearly don't have a clue about documentation if they haven't bothered doing any up to now. Hopefully you've outlined the scale of the task, and that the draft is going to be very "drafty" with such a short (and presumably arbitrary) deadline.

Author:	Zio [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:13 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
kalmar wrote: They pretty clearly don't have a clue about documentation if they haven't bothered doing any up to now. Hopefully you've outlined the scale of the task, and that the draft is going to be very "drafty" with such a short (and presumably arbitrary) deadline. It's utterly staggering. The whole reason it's taken nearly two weeks to get started on anything is because no-one here seems to have the first clue about what sort of documents they need to have, other than the fact they need to have some. On the other hand, I've never actually seen an IT department that seem so efficient in actually getting things done. Presumably because they spend all their time doing things, rather than half their time in meetings and writing docs up!

Author:	Zardoz [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:17 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
You need to begin with a 'what's up doc'.

Author:	kalmar [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:18 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
Zardoz wrote: You need to begin with a 'what's up.doc'.

Author:	DavPaz [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:20 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
Captain Caveman wrote: DavPaz wrote: markh wrote: Can't this be split into a pedantic arguments thread or sub-forum? On the moon. For the first time ever, I've just skipped a load of B&B. LOL, just seen this. SNIP Hey Cavey, I've never had a problem with you in any way, in fact I enjoy your hugely overlong arguing style and amusing style of condescension, but this has massively dropped my opinion of you. I'm usually the first to call for a split of a conversation out of B&B, mainly to ensure that it doesn't get lost under the tedious 'gippes' and Facebook nonsense, not because it's not cerebral or interesting. But fuck me, man, insulting large swathes of the forumites in one post like was immensely impressive. I tell you what, us kids will go and play in the yard. You tool.

Author:	kalmar [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:21 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
Guys, srsly. Simmer down. And leave the gippies out of it!

Author:	Cavey [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:26 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
DavPaz wrote: Captain Caveman wrote: DavPaz wrote: markh wrote: Can't this be split into a pedantic arguments thread or sub-forum? On the moon. For the first time ever, I've just skipped a load of B&B. LOL, just seen this. SNIP Hey Cavey, I've never had a problem with you in any way, in fact I enjoy your hugely overlong arguing style and amusing style of condescension, but this has massively dropped my opinion of you. I'm usually the first to call for a split of a conversation out of B&B, mainly to ensure that it doesn't get lost under the tedious 'gippes' and Facebook nonsense, not because it's not cerebral or interesting. But fuck me, man, insulting large swathes of the forumites in one post like was immensely impressive. I tell you what, us kids will go and play in the yard. You tool. Aw come off it man, lighten up. You'll have to admit, markh's post was a bit shitty and uncalled for, no? I just gave him a taste of his own medicine, and now he's predictably and very impressively gone off in a huff. Hell, I wasn't even thinking of you here at all and think you're a good guy, as it goes. I'm glad I make you and others chuckle; that's pretty much 90% of the point of my being here in the first place. Sorry if I pissed you off here.

Author:	Zardoz [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:27 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
kalmar wrote: Zardoz wrote: You need to begin with a 'what's up.doc'. BAK OV HIPY OR ELS I WIL IGNOR U!!111111

Author:	kalmar [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:29 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks

Author:	DavPaz [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:29 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
Captain Caveman wrote: Sorry if I pissed you off here. Hey, I'm usually pretty easy going, but something about the tone of your reply really ranckled* me. The reason I agreed with the split is B&B just isn't the place for an argument with references Apology accepted and offered in return*. is that a word? I thought it was. ** sorry, drama fans.

Author:	MrChris [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:30 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
The bonfire of the Quangos. It strikes me that a lot of the ones for the chop sound quite useful, although I'm sure their role (and most likely their staff and a lot of costs) will have to be transferred to another body. I also can't help but see a bit of a Tory moral agenda at work here (for the chop: Independent Advisory Group of Sexual Health and HIV, Independent Advisory Group on Teenage Pregnancy etc) A brilliant one is the Human Fertilisation and Embryology Authority - which is not even paid for by the government. Fucking morons. Also - best quango ever: Government Hospitality Advisory Committee on the Purchase of Wines. This must be saved. MUST.

Author:	Zardoz [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:30 ]
Post subject:	Re: Bits and Bobs 22 - Two Little Ducks
Poofs